Crowd pleasing banking regulation...
#31
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Look I don't know what Diamond earns - all I know is it's too much
Seems to do all right though
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...d-pay-barclays
dl
#32
Some traders/bankers have their bonus held back a year so their bonus can reflect 2 years performance not just one. The flaw with this is that to really be accurate and award what is fair you would need to judge over a full cycle from boom to bust and then see their net gains. This means that IMO bonus's should be held back for minimum ten years as any idiot can match a growing market, its those that consistently beat the market through a long period that deserve the big money. The banking industry just rewards its people on far too short term thinking and 3 years is still far too short.
I think this is accepted more in the US than here in the UK. Here in the UK we have this blinkered view that because financial services pays x amount of tax and is x amount of GDP, it is somehow a virtue in itself and 'must go on'. The reality is the financial services only ever enables an economy, it is actually parasitic if it grows too large no matter how much tax it pays. How much is too large, well we found out in 2008.
#33
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Well as I heard George Soros observe that the financial industry had grown out of all proportion to the economy it served. In effect the near crash was Capitalisms way of punishing this miss-allocations.
I think this is accepted more in the US than here in the UK. Here in the UK we have this blinkered view that because financial services pays x amount of tax and is x amount of GDP, it is somehow a virtue in itself and 'must go on'. The reality is the financial services only ever enables an economy, it is actually parasitic if it grows too large no matter how much tax it pays. How much is too large, well we found out in 2008.
I think this is accepted more in the US than here in the UK. Here in the UK we have this blinkered view that because financial services pays x amount of tax and is x amount of GDP, it is somehow a virtue in itself and 'must go on'. The reality is the financial services only ever enables an economy, it is actually parasitic if it grows too large no matter how much tax it pays. How much is too large, well we found out in 2008.
#34
Well as I heard George Soros observe that the financial industry had grown out of all proportion to the economy it served. In effect the near crash was Capitalisms way of punishing this miss-allocations.
I think this is accepted more in the US than here in the UK. Here in the UK we have this blinkered view that because financial services pays x amount of tax and is x amount of GDP, it is somehow a virtue in itself and 'must go on'. The reality is the financial services only ever enables an economy, it is actually parasitic if it grows too large no matter how much tax it pays. How much is too large, well we found out in 2008.
I think this is accepted more in the US than here in the UK. Here in the UK we have this blinkered view that because financial services pays x amount of tax and is x amount of GDP, it is somehow a virtue in itself and 'must go on'. The reality is the financial services only ever enables an economy, it is actually parasitic if it grows too large no matter how much tax it pays. How much is too large, well we found out in 2008.
Perhaps one could argue that it could also be held of the government and the public services it provides.
Not that this (and many other) little piggy is complaining
Last edited by cster; 15 February 2012 at 07:20 AM.
#35
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Well as I heard George Soros observe that the financial industry had grown out of all proportion to the economy it served. In effect the near crash was Capitalisms way of punishing this miss-allocations.
I think this is accepted more in the US than here in the UK. Here in the UK we have this blinkered view that because financial services pays x amount of tax and is x amount of GDP, it is somehow a virtue in itself and 'must go on'. The reality is the financial services only ever enables an economy, it is actually parasitic if it grows too large no matter how much tax it pays. How much is too large, well we found out in 2008.
I think this is accepted more in the US than here in the UK. Here in the UK we have this blinkered view that because financial services pays x amount of tax and is x amount of GDP, it is somehow a virtue in itself and 'must go on'. The reality is the financial services only ever enables an economy, it is actually parasitic if it grows too large no matter how much tax it pays. How much is too large, well we found out in 2008.
Two considerations you need to make in this observation.
One, is that the US banking system needed proportionally more in terms of bailout, for a sector that was primarily servicing the domestic economy.
Secondly, in the UK the banking sector is a contributor to GDP where a great proportion of this comes from none-domestic banking activity. Many international banks run operations out of London, or are headquartered in London so it is effectively an import (HSBC, RBS, Barclays, etc).
#36
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There was a fantastic comment in the Independent today about Liverpool FC.
How low must the club have fallen to be censured by a bank (their shirt sponsor) for their ethical standards
#37
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Look I don't know what Diamond earns - all I know is it's too much
Seems to do all right though
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...d-pay-barclays
dl
Seems to do all right though
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2...d-pay-barclays
dl
And he was still a very long way off the highest paid British based CEO of a global firm
And it wasn't a banker
Last edited by Trout; 15 February 2012 at 10:21 AM.
#38
You can't hold it for 10 years or more, rarely, if at all, an individual in this sector stays in the same role that long for a start. What happens when people move a new trading desk or operation or new company? Trade desks comes and goes depending on the strategy of the organisation to seize opportunities that come and go in the market.
#40
So hold 50% of all banking bonus's back for 15 years and use the money as part of a bail out fund next time they **** up. They all get back what they put in after 15 years without a banking disaster, also make derivatives and futures contracts illegal unless you can prove you are in a position to take delivery of an actual product. I would also put a maximum number of trades per day per trader, perhaps 8 or 9. Too many people get paid based on how many trades they make, nothing about how good those trades are this encourages bad practice . Last I looked a good value real time trader was charging not far off 250 per trade, I don't know how much of that they keep but they had plenty of incentive to convince people to shuffle money around.
#42
Secondly, in the UK the banking sector is a contributor to GDP where a great proportion of this comes from none-domestic banking activity. Many international banks run operations out of London, or are headquartered in London so it is effectively an import (HSBC, RBS, Barclays, etc).
I think you mean export BTW but I know what you mean.
We're just engaged in a zero-sum game, race to the bottom, when it comes to 'attracting' financial services to HQ in this country.
It could be making match-sticks or any industry really. Banking seems a kind of holy cow.
#44
#45
Its the very nature of banking that people expect safe conservative descison making not out and out gambling with their savings and pensions, not in the least because so many people got paid so well to **** up.
#46
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Was trying to stick to the UK angle - but you are right - true in the US as well.
#48
At the same time people demand that the banks to give them the best returns possible on their savings and pensions. Sure there are people who would be happy to receive interest a few points above the base rate on their investment, the banking industry could plod along giving everyone mediocre returns. But as investors become more savvy with their money and demand ever more exotic products, the majority expect banks to maximize their return on their investments. I would stick my neck and say that even you have savings and investments that are more than just a safe deposit account.
#49
#50
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but isn't that what they have been doing jon, on the whole, as an industry -- pretty shoddy returns, and poor shareholder value
obviously you will have exceptions, but with such high fees, for a decent return you really have to out perform the average by quite a margin, which the majority don't
obviously you will have exceptions, but with such high fees, for a decent return you really have to out perform the average by quite a margin, which the majority don't
#51
#54
but isn't that what they have been doing jon, on the whole, as an industry -- pretty shoddy returns, and poor shareholder value
obviously you will have exceptions, but with such high fees, for a decent return you really have to out perform the average by quite a margin, which the majority don't
obviously you will have exceptions, but with such high fees, for a decent return you really have to out perform the average by quite a margin, which the majority don't
Sentiment in the banking sector is at all time low, with banks and bankers perceived as pariahs of society by ministers, the media, the general public and what with new restrictive regulations, are you surprised that bank shares are what they are today?
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