Do the Scottish get a better deal ?
30 October 2012, 08:43 PM
#94
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from a biased organisation whos sole purpose is to stop wind turbines getting put up next to their houses
and not numbers from some snidey newpaper reports either as we all know newpapers always tell the truth
Last edited by nizmo80; 30 October 2012 at 08:49 PM.
30 October 2012, 08:55 PM
#95
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Originally Posted by The Trooper 1815
Logical thought is not something Salmond does. He now wants to be in NATO with Regiments and Battalions who struggle to recruit. Will all the Fijian soldiers retain their citizenship and rights?
Why not be in NATO? Lost to be gained and little to be lost. It makes good sense for an independent country to be part of, and have the support of others.
Non resident jocks can't vote!
Quite right. If they chose not to live here why should they have a say?
If jock MP's are allowed to vote in Westminster, why can't they vote in a jock election?
Apples and oranges. Scottish MP's elected to Westmister are elected for that very reason - to be able to vote on matters concering the governance of Great Britain. English MP's are not, however, elected to the Scottish Parliament and therefore correctly should not be voting on matters that have been devolved to that Scottish Parliament. MSP's don't have any say in Westminster and MP's have no say in Holyrood
Natural resources that are running out?
Don't believe the spin. Those in the oil and gas industry know otherwise. Yes, extraction is more complicated, but technology has moved on.
Salmond is starting to get ****e from the MSP's over the "legal" advice he's got! Is he telling pork pies?
Again, don't believe the spin.
Bring all the Defence jobs from Faslane down south, the Army
Personnel Centre in Glasgow and all the dosh the relocated Germany units would have brought
Faslane has, for more years than I care to remember been a naval base. It would continue to be a naval base without Trident. Which submarines, in reality, spend more time in the US (where the missiles are maintained and managed) or at sea. There is so much more to Faslane (and Coulport) than 3 submarines with ICBM capability and to suggests otherwise (as Labour are intent on doing) is to discredit the importance of every other member of the military who works there. Likewise the APC in Glasgow.
Like I said above (excuse the earlier typo) - please don't try and comment on that about which you know f*ck all
Logical thought is not something Salmond does. He now wants to be in NATO with Regiments and Battalions who struggle to recruit. Will all the Fijian soldiers retain their citizenship and rights?
Why not be in NATO? Lost to be gained and little to be lost. It makes good sense for an independent country to be part of, and have the support of others.
Non resident jocks can't vote!
Quite right. If they chose not to live here why should they have a say?
If jock MP's are allowed to vote in Westminster, why can't they vote in a jock election?
Apples and oranges. Scottish MP's elected to Westmister are elected for that very reason - to be able to vote on matters concering the governance of Great Britain. English MP's are not, however, elected to the Scottish Parliament and therefore correctly should not be voting on matters that have been devolved to that Scottish Parliament. MSP's don't have any say in Westminster and MP's have no say in Holyrood
Natural resources that are running out?
Don't believe the spin. Those in the oil and gas industry know otherwise. Yes, extraction is more complicated, but technology has moved on.
Salmond is starting to get ****e from the MSP's over the "legal" advice he's got! Is he telling pork pies?
Again, don't believe the spin.
Bring all the Defence jobs from Faslane down south, the Army
Personnel Centre in Glasgow and all the dosh the relocated Germany units would have brought
Faslane has, for more years than I care to remember been a naval base. It would continue to be a naval base without Trident. Which submarines, in reality, spend more time in the US (where the missiles are maintained and managed) or at sea. There is so much more to Faslane (and Coulport) than 3 submarines with ICBM capability and to suggests otherwise (as Labour are intent on doing) is to discredit the importance of every other member of the military who works there. Likewise the APC in Glasgow.
Like I said above (excuse the earlier typo) - please don't try and comment on that about which you know f*ck all
30 October 2012, 09:01 PM
#97
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You could ask the same thing about Cornwall, for instance, and the answer would be the same.
It's only a matter of importance to Scottish people, Scott. If we started doing the maths and expelling every area that didn't pull their weight financially, we'd have a United States of Great Britain. And frankly we just don't want that. We're actually happy having Scotland "in the club". Hard to imagine for many Scots i know, but it's true by and large.
30 October 2012, 09:05 PM
#98
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Because, for most English people, there is no need/reason/incentive to break up the United Kingdom for purely financial reasons.
You could ask the same thing about Cornwall, for instance, and the answer would be the same.
It's only a matter of importance to Scottish people, Scott. If we started doing the maths and expelling every area that didn't pull their weight financially, we'd have a United States of Great Britain. And frankly we just don't want that. We're actually happy having Scotland "in the club". Hard to imagine for many Scots i know, but it's true by and large.
You could ask the same thing about Cornwall, for instance, and the answer would be the same.
It's only a matter of importance to Scottish people, Scott. If we started doing the maths and expelling every area that didn't pull their weight financially, we'd have a United States of Great Britain. And frankly we just don't want that. We're actually happy having Scotland "in the club". Hard to imagine for many Scots i know, but it's true by and large.
here is the thing telboy for many scots including my self a lot of us dont want to be in the club and want to do things our own way.
dont get me wrong I think strong ties between our countrys should be kept
but for many of us we want to forge our own path
and yes it can be hard to imagine for some scots
more so when we have been branded by so many a drain on the tax system and called iron bru swigging deep fried mars bar eating dole scroungers
by some narrow minded people " in the past thats what has been said to me but not on this forum "
when in fact I am a highly trained high profile oil worker who travels the world and works accross the north sea on multi million pound jobs
is it any wonder that for so many of us that we just want our independence
Last edited by nizmo80; 30 October 2012 at 09:20 PM.
30 October 2012, 09:10 PM
#99
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Yep i totally get that, as far as i'm able. Scottish patriotism is generally stronger than English patriotism i reckon. Always the underdog and all that. Totally get that. But i just don't think it would be beneficial for either country to sever legislative links. Just smaller ships bobbing about in a world ocean rather than a partnership of countries with centuries of history on one single island. I prefer strength in numbers.
30 October 2012, 09:15 PM
#100
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[QUOTE=nizmo80;10849893]depends show me numbers from a neutral orginisationQUOTE]
who would that be the goverment, lol. Just look at increases in energy bills.
who would that be the goverment, lol. Just look at increases in energy bills.
30 October 2012, 09:15 PM
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Yep i totally get that, as far as i'm able. Scottish patriotism is generally stronger than English patriotism i reckon. Always the underdog and all that. Totally get that. But i just don't think it would be beneficial for either country to sever legislative links. Just smaller ships bobbing about in a world ocean rather than a partnership of countries with centuries of history on one single island. I prefer strength in numbers.
yes strength in numbers is always going to be best
and I do hope we get independence but I also hope if we do get it we also keep a very strong bond between our countrys
30 October 2012, 09:18 PM
#102
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[quote=euan_r;10849958]
you mean the increase in energy bills from greedy private energy companys which used to be reasnobly priced when it was owned by the
english goverment before it was sold to private investors then prices were put on the money escelator
And I agree the energy bills are a joke and are crippling people with the costs
you can thank thatcher the snatcher for that nuff said really
you mean the increase in energy bills from greedy private energy companys which used to be reasnobly priced when it was owned by the
english goverment before it was sold to private investors then prices were put on the money escelator
And I agree the energy bills are a joke and are crippling people with the costs
you can thank thatcher the snatcher for that nuff said really
Last edited by nizmo80; 30 October 2012 at 09:25 PM.
30 October 2012, 09:21 PM
#103
Originally Posted by The Trooper 1815
Logical thought is not something Salmond does. He now wants to be in NATO with Regiments and Battalions who struggle to recruit. Will all the Fijian soldiers retain their citizenship and rights?
Why not be in NATO? Lost to be gained and little to be lost. It makes good sense for an independent country to be part of, and have the support of others.
Non resident jocks can't vote!
Quite right. If they chose not to live here why should they have a say?
If jock MP's are allowed to vote in Westminster, why can't they vote in a jock election?
Apples and oranges. Scottish MP's elected to Westmister are elected for that very reason - to be able to vote on matters concering the governance of Great Britain. English MP's are not, however, elected to the Scottish Parliament and therefore correctly should not be voting on matters that have been devolved to that Scottish Parliament. MSP's don't have any say in Westminster and MP's have no say in Holyrood
Natural resources that are running out?
Don't believe the spin. Those in the oil and gas industry know otherwise. Yes, extraction is more complicated, but technology has moved on.
Salmond is starting to get ****e from the MSP's over the "legal" advice he's got! Is he telling pork pies?
Again, don't believe the spin.
Bring all the Defence jobs from Faslane down south, the Army
Personnel Centre in Glasgow and all the dosh the relocated Germany units would have brought
Faslane has, for more years than I care to remember been a naval base. It would continue to be a naval base without Trident. Which submarines, in reality, spend more time in the US (where the missiles are maintained and managed) or at sea. There is so much more to Faslane (and Coulport) than 3 submarines with ICBM capability and to suggests otherwise (as Labour are intent on doing) is to discredit the importance of every other member of the military who works there. Likewise the APC in Glasgow.
Like I said above (excuse the earlier typo) - please don't try and comment on that about which you know f*ck all
Logical thought is not something Salmond does. He now wants to be in NATO with Regiments and Battalions who struggle to recruit. Will all the Fijian soldiers retain their citizenship and rights?
Why not be in NATO? Lost to be gained and little to be lost. It makes good sense for an independent country to be part of, and have the support of others.
Non resident jocks can't vote!
Quite right. If they chose not to live here why should they have a say?
If jock MP's are allowed to vote in Westminster, why can't they vote in a jock election?
Apples and oranges. Scottish MP's elected to Westmister are elected for that very reason - to be able to vote on matters concering the governance of Great Britain. English MP's are not, however, elected to the Scottish Parliament and therefore correctly should not be voting on matters that have been devolved to that Scottish Parliament. MSP's don't have any say in Westminster and MP's have no say in Holyrood
Natural resources that are running out?
Don't believe the spin. Those in the oil and gas industry know otherwise. Yes, extraction is more complicated, but technology has moved on.
Salmond is starting to get ****e from the MSP's over the "legal" advice he's got! Is he telling pork pies?
Again, don't believe the spin.
Bring all the Defence jobs from Faslane down south, the Army
Personnel Centre in Glasgow and all the dosh the relocated Germany units would have brought
Faslane has, for more years than I care to remember been a naval base. It would continue to be a naval base without Trident. Which submarines, in reality, spend more time in the US (where the missiles are maintained and managed) or at sea. There is so much more to Faslane (and Coulport) than 3 submarines with ICBM capability and to suggests otherwise (as Labour are intent on doing) is to discredit the importance of every other member of the military who works there. Likewise the APC in Glasgow.
Like I said above (excuse the earlier typo) - please don't try and comment on that about which you know f*ck all
The inability of jock regiments to recruit will cause the failure of NATO membership. Or will independence bring back conscription due to the lack of scottish jobs? The Scots Dragoon Guards are knows as The Scots.Fiji, most of the Army Rugby Team come from jock reiments, it's a stamding joke within HM Forces.
Don't assume I know nothing or f**k all as you so eloquently posted.
30 October 2012, 09:32 PM
#104
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So why as the Minister of the Armed Forces just visited (at short notice) military facilities in the Vale of Glamorgan and the old US Naval depot.in West Wales. The re-basing study is getting a rejig. Do the Scottish Independence economists want to lose the potential revenue.
The inability of jock regiments to recruit will cause the failure of NATO membership. Or will independence bring back conscription due to the lack of scottish jobs? The Scots Dragoon Guards are knows as The Scots.Fiji, most of the Army Rugby Team come from jock reiments, it's a stamding joke within HM Forces.
Don't assume I know nothing or f**k all as you so eloquently posted.
The inability of jock regiments to recruit will cause the failure of NATO membership. Or will independence bring back conscription due to the lack of scottish jobs? The Scots Dragoon Guards are knows as The Scots.Fiji, most of the Army Rugby Team come from jock reiments, it's a stamding joke within HM Forces.
Don't assume I know nothing or f**k all as you so eloquently posted.
is it because you were in the army and know very little about anything else ?
30 October 2012, 09:33 PM
#105
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So why as the Minister of the Armed Forces just visited (at short notice) military facilities in the Vale of Glamorgan and the old US Naval depot.in West Wales. The re-basing study is getting a rejig. Do the Scottish Independence economists want to lose the potential revenue.
The inability of jock regiments to recruit will cause the failure of NATO membership. Or will independence bring back conscription due to the lack of scottish jobs? The Scots Dragoon Guards are knows as The Scots.Fiji, most of the Army Rugby Team come from jock reiments, it's a stamding joke within HM Forces.
Don't assume I know nothing or f**k all as you so eloquently posted.
The inability of jock regiments to recruit will cause the failure of NATO membership. Or will independence bring back conscription due to the lack of scottish jobs? The Scots Dragoon Guards are knows as The Scots.Fiji, most of the Army Rugby Team come from jock reiments, it's a stamding joke within HM Forces.
Don't assume I know nothing or f**k all as you so eloquently posted.
Independence is at the earliest several years away. Who knows - could be any one of a hundred reasons. The closure of Leuchars and the other reorganisations to date have been entirely down to Westminster and nothing to do with independence. I suspect the reality is defence cuts - nothing more, nothing less.
NATO membership is not soley dependent upon Scottish regimental numbers. There is much more to it than that. And who's to say an Independent Scotland wouldn't have increased take up? We certainly wouldn't be fighting wars just to suck America's dick.
30 October 2012, 09:35 PM
#106
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You tell me why mate. I'm not the keeper of the Minister's diary.
Independence is at the earliest several years away. Who knows - could be any one of a hundred reasons. The closure of Leuchars and the other reorganisations to date have been entirely down to Westminster and nothing to do with independence. I suspect the reality is defence cuts - nothing more, nothing less.
NATO membership is not soley dependent upon Scottish regimental numbers. There is much more to it than that. And who's to say an Independent Scotland wouldn't have increased take up? We certainly wouldn't be fighting wars just to suck America's dick.
Independence is at the earliest several years away. Who knows - could be any one of a hundred reasons. The closure of Leuchars and the other reorganisations to date have been entirely down to Westminster and nothing to do with independence. I suspect the reality is defence cuts - nothing more, nothing less.
NATO membership is not soley dependent upon Scottish regimental numbers. There is much more to it than that. And who's to say an Independent Scotland wouldn't have increased take up? We certainly wouldn't be fighting wars just to suck America's dick.
classic pure epic
30 October 2012, 09:50 PM
#107
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You tell me why mate. I'm not the keeper of the Minister's diary.
Independence is at the earliest several years away. Who knows - could be any one of a hundred reasons. The closure of Leuchars and the other reorganisations to date have been entirely down to Westminster and nothing to do with independence. I suspect the reality is defence cuts - nothing more, nothing less.
NATO membership is not soley dependent upon Scottish regimental numbers. There is much more to it than that. And who's to say an Independent Scotland wouldn't have increased take up? We certainly wouldn't be fighting wars just to suck America's dick.
Independence is at the earliest several years away. Who knows - could be any one of a hundred reasons. The closure of Leuchars and the other reorganisations to date have been entirely down to Westminster and nothing to do with independence. I suspect the reality is defence cuts - nothing more, nothing less.
NATO membership is not soley dependent upon Scottish regimental numbers. There is much more to it than that. And who's to say an Independent Scotland wouldn't have increased take up? We certainly wouldn't be fighting wars just to suck America's dick.
Last edited by JTaylor; 30 October 2012 at 09:55 PM.
30 October 2012, 09:55 PM
#108
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There's not enough folk in Scotland to support the infrastructure required to run a small country that includes Glasgow !
So If they can jig the referendum so Glasgow remains in England - I'm in
So If they can jig the referendum so Glasgow remains in England - I'm in
31 October 2012, 12:15 AM
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here is the thing telboy for many scots including my self a lot of us dont want to be in the club and want to do things our own way.
dont get me wrong I think strong ties between our countrys should be kept
but for many of us we want to forge our own path
and yes it can be hard to imagine for some scots
more so when we have been branded by so many a drain on the tax system and called iron bru swigging deep fried mars bar eating dole scroungers
by some narrow minded people " in the past thats what has been said to me but not on this forum "
when in fact I am a highly trained high profile oil worker who travels the world and works accross the north sea on multi million pound jobs
is it any wonder that for so many of us that we just want our independence
dont get me wrong I think strong ties between our countrys should be kept
but for many of us we want to forge our own path
and yes it can be hard to imagine for some scots
more so when we have been branded by so many a drain on the tax system and called iron bru swigging deep fried mars bar eating dole scroungers
by some narrow minded people " in the past thats what has been said to me but not on this forum "
when in fact I am a highly trained high profile oil worker who travels the world and works accross the north sea on multi million pound jobs
is it any wonder that for so many of us that we just want our independence
That's some kind of independence?
Also no one has mentioned the deficit; Scotland from day one is going to have to deal with its share of our debt. I still haven't heard how Salmond will deal with this. Although he does have a uni-policy going, which basically equates to tax ('the rich' mainly) more.
How is he planning on stopping the wealth heading south?
Wake up, please wake up
31 October 2012, 12:20 AM
#110
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'Do it your own way'.. by what, keeping the Currency and the Head of State?
That's some kind of independence?
Also no one has mentioned the deficit; Scotland from day one is going to have to deal with its share of our debt. I still haven't heard how Salmond will deal with this. Although he does have a uni-policy going, which basically equates to tax ('the rich' mainly) more.
How is he planning on stopping the wealth heading south?
Wake up, please wake up
That's some kind of independence?
Also no one has mentioned the deficit; Scotland from day one is going to have to deal with its share of our debt. I still haven't heard how Salmond will deal with this. Although he does have a uni-policy going, which basically equates to tax ('the rich' mainly) more.
How is he planning on stopping the wealth heading south?
Wake up, please wake up
here is how the debt should work
55 milion people in england and 5 million people in scotland
we will take 5 million peoples worth of the debt which works out to be 8.33% dont ask for a penny more as you wont get it
PMSL but seriously 
31 October 2012, 12:28 AM
#111
Missing the key point from the OP - more per head of population is spent on Scotland.
31 October 2012, 12:31 AM
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My point was how is Salmond proposing Scotland becomes independent, whilst deferring all fiscal control to the Bank of England yet be able to pay off its debt - now given his hard-left brand of politics, that can mean only one thing MORE TAX, and the subsequent inevitable flight south
So quite why you needed to 'pmsl' I don't quite understand
I do hope that the separatist have better arguments to deploy than you do, or you're fuked
Last edited by Martin2005; 31 October 2012 at 12:33 AM.
31 October 2012, 12:37 AM
#113
15 years ago, nobody gave a **** about breakup of the union, it as a non-issue. This is simply Salmond's wet dream coming to fruition. I feel sorry for the folk being suckered into it, believing the rhetoric spewed. 
31 October 2012, 12:39 AM
#114
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Who's arguing that the debt shouldn't be divided fairly?? You're a strange chap aren't you
My point was how is Salmond proposing Scotland becomes independent, whilst deferring all fiscal control to the Bank of England yet be able to pay off its debt.
So quite why you needed to 'pmsl' I don't quite understand
I do hope that the separatist have better arguments to deploy than you do, or you're fuked
My point was how is Salmond proposing Scotland becomes independent, whilst deferring all fiscal control to the Bank of England yet be able to pay off its debt.
So quite why you needed to 'pmsl' I don't quite understand
I do hope that the separatist have better arguments to deploy than you do, or you're fuked
not strange at all I just find it funny when people like yourself say things " what about the national debt " and it should be divided fairly also by fairly do you mean a large portion of that debt be on scotland to pay ?
I would say around 8.33% would be around the fairness mark well maybe a bit more
as skyline pointed out maybe we do get a bit more spent on us
and the " PMSL " is just me joking around and if you cant understand that or dont find it humorous well thats your problem mate
Last edited by nizmo80; 31 October 2012 at 12:41 AM.
31 October 2012, 12:44 AM
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not strange at all I just find it funny when people like yourself say things " what about the national debt " and it should be divided fairly also by fairly do you mean a large portion of that debt be on scotland to pay ?
I would say around 8.33% would be around the fairness mark well maybe a bit more
as skyline pointed out maybe we do get a bit more spent on us
and the " PMSL " is just me joking around and if you cant understand that or dont find it humorous well thats your problem mate
I would say around 8.33% would be around the fairness mark well maybe a bit more
as skyline pointed out maybe we do get a bit more spent on us
and the " PMSL " is just me joking around and if you cant understand that or dont find it humorous well thats your problem mate
I'm completely relaxed about the formula you outlined, seems fair enough to me.
Now please answer the questions
Oh and btw what do you mean be 'people like yourself'???
Last edited by Martin2005; 31 October 2012 at 12:46 AM.
31 October 2012, 12:48 AM
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I am only joking around
31 October 2012, 12:58 AM
#118
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Why do the Scottish feel independence will better themselves....
Not quite that though is it. Is it indeed because they dont want to be governed by a foreign land......
Is it after all these years a hatred remains for the English.....
Not quite that though is it. Is it indeed because they dont want to be governed by a foreign land......
Is it after all these years a hatred remains for the English.....
Last edited by craigo; 31 October 2012 at 12:59 AM.
31 October 2012, 01:01 AM
#119
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As I said before in a previous post i do not dislike the english
In all honesty they are people like any other and I personaly dont mind them
but I dont like the english goverment and the way the conduct things and
yes I dont want to be governed by them.
31 October 2012, 01:07 AM
#120
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There is no such entity as 'the English Government' so it's actually not possible to dislike them.
Is this the basis of your desire for independence? To swap a government that doesn't exist, for a bunch of stuck in a time-warp, socialists?