Teachers giving themselves the summer off...
20 March 2013, 06:55 PM
#61
There are so many comments I'd like to reply to on this thread, but I'll stick to a selection from page 1.
I agree that performance related pay is a good thing. With regards to the rest of your comments, do you think it's the fault of the teachers that they are afraid to say anything to the pupils, or the fault of the parents and society in general for siding with the kids for everything? In my days at school, which wasn't too long ago, my parents would automatically have sided with the Teacher, sadly this no longer happens.
And do you think it's fair for anybody to change what you are contracted to do without your permission or even consideration?
Don't even know what to say to that.
My Wife is a teacher and because of cuts to her school she now teaches 4 separate subjects. She is in School from 8:00-18:00 every day, then at least 4 nights a week works 3hrs or more at home doing lesson plans and marking. This is on top of doing a Head of Year Duty which mainly consists of speaking to parents, who generally couldn't care less about their own kids.
One parent refused to give her Daughter the bus fair to get to her work experience week. The girl then walked to School where my Wife allowed her to work, and even bought her some more work suited trousers and fed her lunch for the week. Bit of a long/pointless story, but this is the sort of Parenting that is causing the generation of kids that are currently being schooled at the minute
I personally think that performance related pay is a good thing, especially for teachers. They are teaching the next generation, and if they're not doing a very good job at it, god only knows how many mindless chavs and scumbags there will be roaming our streets in a few years. I think the problem lies within the discipline side of teaching. Teachers are so terrified of dishing out discipline, its not done anymore and kids are treated with kid-gloves, thus allowing them to get away with pretty much whatever they want. Combine this with the ever-increasing amount of parents who seemingly let their kids do anything / give them anything they want, and you have a ticking time bomb on your hands. Parents and teachers need to learn how to say a simple word......'NO'.
If you're a teacher and don't like the thought odf performance-related pay, then there are plenty of people that will happily step into your shoes and take your jobs!
I feel i'm qualified to say the former aswell before I start getting bombarded with 'anti-teacher' comments. I have just spent a year on the Army recruiting team (I am a full time soldier) and have been to more schools / colleges / uni's than you can shake a stick at. I have seen how teachers talk to and act around kids and teens, like they're almost petrified of saying the wrong thing in-case they get a warning / suspended etc etc. Its a joke to be honest. I do hasten to add however that I have seen some brilliant teachers that control the class and command respect from their pupils. Unfortunately these are fairly few and far between.
If you're a teacher and don't like the thought odf performance-related pay, then there are plenty of people that will happily step into your shoes and take your jobs!
I feel i'm qualified to say the former aswell before I start getting bombarded with 'anti-teacher' comments. I have just spent a year on the Army recruiting team (I am a full time soldier) and have been to more schools / colleges / uni's than you can shake a stick at. I have seen how teachers talk to and act around kids and teens, like they're almost petrified of saying the wrong thing in-case they get a warning / suspended etc etc. Its a joke to be honest. I do hasten to add however that I have seen some brilliant teachers that control the class and command respect from their pupils. Unfortunately these are fairly few and far between.
And do you think it's fair for anybody to change what you are contracted to do without your permission or even consideration?
Don't even know what to say to that. My Wife is a teacher and because of cuts to her school she now teaches 4 separate subjects. She is in School from 8:00-18:00 every day, then at least 4 nights a week works 3hrs or more at home doing lesson plans and marking. This is on top of doing a Head of Year Duty which mainly consists of speaking to parents, who generally couldn't care less about their own kids.
One parent refused to give her Daughter the bus fair to get to her work experience week. The girl then walked to School where my Wife allowed her to work, and even bought her some more work suited trousers and fed her lunch for the week. Bit of a long/pointless story, but this is the sort of Parenting that is causing the generation of kids that are currently being schooled at the minute
20 March 2013, 07:15 PM
#62
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put your toys back in the pram, Sunshine, and look at (a) my previous posts on this matter, and (b) my various array of smilies.
The penny will drop. Eventually
The penny will drop. Eventually
20 March 2013, 07:26 PM
#63
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Performance related pay strikes fear into the hearts of many teachers, I wonder why ?
20 March 2013, 07:39 PM
#64
However, calling me sunshine just makes you sound like the typical teacher that nobody likes, and I'd rather you didn't do it
20 March 2013, 11:13 PM
#66
I could also mention teachers I had at school who had no understanding of the subject they were trying to teach, one in particular had no knowledge of maths despite a university degree in maths and was relying on the geek kids in class to help him along. Fact is the only people I meet who do not think the teaching profession needs a serious overhaul are already within the education system and may have to actually try to get better at their jobs.
Performance related pay strikes fear into the hearts of many teachers, I wonder why ?
Performance related pay strikes fear into the hearts of many teachers, I wonder why ?
Couldn't TEACH maybe...?
And there's the next thing: Gove wants all teachers to have a 2:1 at least...WHY?????
21 March 2013, 02:28 PM
#67
Originally Posted by alcazar
Gove wants all teachers to have a 2:1 at least...WHY?????
21 March 2013, 10:02 PM
#69
Well, I suppose one advantage of them being well qualified is that they should have no trouble finding alternate employment if the T & Cs of a career in teaching don't agree with them.
22 March 2013, 01:38 AM
#71
Seriously though, there seems to be a lot of disgruntled teachers out there.
Maybe they should try something else. It is not that radical an idea.
I certainly think it would be beneficial to all concerned if they at least had other working experience before entering the profession.
Otherwise, what is it - school, followed by university, followed by school, followed by retirement? What kind of a career is that for a university graduate? A very safe but very dull way to pass your life IMO.
The growing realisation that a good few of your pupils are brighter than you probably doesn't provide much comfort either.
When speaking with teachers, one gets the impression that the holidays and retirement benefits of their vocation are the biggest draw - the teaching part almost an interregnum encumbrance.
It just seems all wrong to me.
Of course, it is always possible it're me that is wrong.
Last edited by cster; 22 March 2013 at 01:40 AM.
22 March 2013, 11:45 AM
#72
Well let's just hope the English degree holders know when to say there are and when to say there is - otherwise it is definately only teaching for them.
Seriously though, there seems to be a lot of disgruntled teachers out there.
Maybe they should try something else. It is not that radical an idea.
I certainly think it would be beneficial to all concerned if they at least had other working experience before entering the profession.
Otherwise, what is it - school, followed by university, followed by school, followed by retirement? What kind of a career is that for a university graduate? A very safe but very dull way to pass your life IMO.
The growing realisation that a good few of your pupils are brighter than you probably doesn't provide much comfort either.
When speaking with teachers, one gets the impression that the holidays and retirement benefits of their vocation are the biggest draw - the teaching part almost an interregnum encumbrance.
It just seems all wrong to me.
Of course, it is always possible it're me that is wrong.
Seriously though, there seems to be a lot of disgruntled teachers out there.
Maybe they should try something else. It is not that radical an idea.
I certainly think it would be beneficial to all concerned if they at least had other working experience before entering the profession.
Otherwise, what is it - school, followed by university, followed by school, followed by retirement? What kind of a career is that for a university graduate? A very safe but very dull way to pass your life IMO.
The growing realisation that a good few of your pupils are brighter than you probably doesn't provide much comfort either.
When speaking with teachers, one gets the impression that the holidays and retirement benefits of their vocation are the biggest draw - the teaching part almost an interregnum encumbrance.
It just seems all wrong to me.
Of course, it is always possible it're me that is wrong.
22 March 2013, 12:11 PM
#74
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Reading this and other threads teachers remind me of cyclists. Like you can never find a cyclist who admits to running a red light yet plenty do you can never find a teacher who claims not to be in school from 8am to 6pm and to work every night marking and to work all through their holidays preparing for the new term yet the local school here has no cars in its car park until 9am and none after 4:30pm... go figure
22 March 2013, 01:06 PM
#77
Reading this and other threads teachers remind me of cyclists. Like you can never find a cyclist who admits to running a red light yet plenty do you can never find a teacher who claims not to be in school from 8am to 6pm and to work every night marking and to work all through their holidays preparing for the new term yet the local school here has no cars in its car park until 9am and none after 4:30pm... go figure
22 March 2013, 01:54 PM
#78
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Having lived right next to a school for over thirty years I feel qualified to comment on this. I'm not teacher bashing by the way as I feel in the main they do a good job under some difficult circumstances. The vast majority of the teachers would arrive at around the same time as the pupils, between 8.30 and 8.45 (school started at 8.50). Similarly when the school finished (3.35) you would only find the caretaker and cleaners after 4.
The truth lies half way between the 'they're all lazy *******s who don't know how good they've got it' and 'they all work horrendiusly long hours and are really hard done by'.... like most jobs really!
22 March 2013, 03:55 PM
#80
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I have worked in 3 schools in the last 24 years and ,as i said in my last post, found most staff worked hard and long hours but i can only say that is true of those schools . Icouldnt and wouldnt make an assumption that all schools do the same
22 March 2013, 05:00 PM
#83
When speaking with teachers, one gets the impression that the holidays and retirement benefits of their vocation are the biggest draw - the teaching part almost an interregnum encumbrance.
It just seems all wrong to me.
Of course, it is always possible it're me that is wrong.
It just seems all wrong to me.
Of course, it is always possible it're me that is wrong.
Muahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!
22 March 2013, 05:47 PM
#84
Well it was after a late one at my local and I don't like using spell checkers- what's your excuse?
Can't say I'm aware of another profession that seems to be as fixated about their holiday and pension entitlements - of course I would love to hear otherwise if you actually have anything to say on the matter.
Last edited by cster; 22 March 2013 at 06:29 PM.
22 March 2013, 06:09 PM
#85
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Both my sisters are teachers as is my bro in law and cousin. They seem to enjoy it but do moan about hard work. Seems an okay deal to me; reasonable salary, low likelihood of being fired, big holidays, etc.
Doesn't appeal to me but I do find teaching my own young kids stuff very satisfying so I can see the attraction.
Doesn't appeal to me but I do find teaching my own young kids stuff very satisfying so I can see the attraction.
23 March 2013, 12:08 AM
#87
BTW: full marks for using "interregnum", makes you look like you aren't a loser, even though you HAVE admitted it
23 March 2013, 12:12 AM
#88
Both my sisters are teachers as is my bro in law and cousin. They seem to enjoy it but do moan about hard work. Seems an okay deal to me; reasonable salary, low likelihood of being fired, big holidays, etc.
Doesn't appeal to me but I do find teaching my own young kids stuff very satisfying so I can see the attraction.
Doesn't appeal to me but I do find teaching my own young kids stuff very satisfying so I can see the attraction.
Teaching those who don't even want to be there, let alone learn, and whose parents don't give a flying fek and would rather take on the school than their own kid...is definitely NOT fun.
I've seen good teachers.
I would LOVE to see some of those with the most to say against teachers, stand up and do the job with a class of twenty or so recalcitrant 16 year-olds...on your own, door closed, for an hour or more? In fact I'd LIKE to see you just keep order, let alone teach owt.
No takers? Thought not
23 March 2013, 12:19 AM
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Teaching ONE or TWO kids who WANT to learn is fun. teaching quite a few who WANT TO LEARN, is fun.
Teaching those who don't even want to be there, let alone learn, and whose parents don't give a flying fek and would rather take on the school than their own kid...is definitely NOT fun.
I've seen good teachers.
I would LOVE to see some of those with the most to say against teachers, stand up and do the job with a class of twenty or so recalcitrant 16 year-olds...on your own, door closed, for an hour or more? In fact I'd LIKE to see you just keep order, let alone teach owt.
No takers? Thought not
Teaching those who don't even want to be there, let alone learn, and whose parents don't give a flying fek and would rather take on the school than their own kid...is definitely NOT fun.
I've seen good teachers.
I would LOVE to see some of those with the most to say against teachers, stand up and do the job with a class of twenty or so recalcitrant 16 year-olds...on your own, door closed, for an hour or more? In fact I'd LIKE to see you just keep order, let alone teach owt.
No takers? Thought not
Oh wait, we get another 66 in September anyway