jamin

I have owned my GTiR for a month now and if I was honest only bought it because it was a lot cheaper than a WRX but since having it am well pleased. I just like the fact that they are rare, admittedly old and some might say ugly (I know I do!) As to which is quicker I won't get involved as we could be here a long time!!....

Surry

Hi all, just over from the gtir owners, i have never had a problem against scobbies and have raced loads, maybe i havent came up against a decently tuned one yet, but my r is pretty well modded, runs 1.5bar boost and will be down the pod on sunday if any of you want to see how a decently modded one goes.

I aint saying that the gearbox wont blow to bits as this is the week link, but i am importing a 1/2 dog box in the next couple of months so will have no probs then.

Just my two pennies worth, must admit though i dont know what it is about some scoobies but they sound rude.

Cheers

Surry

scoobynewboy

Nippy litte bu**ers alright...
My friend has on of these and it was a good match for my last V5 Type R up to about 90-100mph. After that the poor Sunny died a death or rather was murdered.
"Horrid" looking little blighters too..

323roy

r u lot missing the point , some r raving about a tuned pulser... nice car no doubt . what about a performance scooby ? ... is it still close ? or is it down 2 the driver??

skiddusmarkus

On standard boost mine did 13.6sec 1/4.It's a bit more now and I'm reckoning on low 13 to high 12secs.I love scoobs but when I was looking for a new car 3 years ago they were about 3 grand more than a gtir(cost me £7k).I find mine pulls very well at low speeds and up to 100mph(was recently held up by an FQ300 to that speed) but I don't really go over that apart from on track.Most owners seem to tune them and whereas I've noticed on this BBS people are quite impressed by 270bhp,on the gtir BBS that's nothing out of the ordinary.People change the suspension brakes etc out of necessity due to the age but also because you get bored with standard items and like to improve the car(as with any other).However,since doing numerous suspension mods to mine,although it handles far better,I have to pay more attention when driving as it seems a lot less forgiving.Or maybe I'm just going faster

Wizzbang

From my experiences down here on the south coast, the scoobs arent a match for a GTi-R under road driving, no stupid 1/4 mile times interest me, although for the record my previous pulsar did 0-60 in 4.71 secs (trax 2000 + 2001) quickest scoob i saw was just about under 5 secs (and my new R does go faster). As for gear ratios theyre pretty much the same. I turned up for a few meets around the south in my previous R (Red H under the nick' GTiR99) and got nothing but total respect from the scooby owners. I used to think about getting a scoob before the R but glad I didnt cos theyre so common now and also driven by everyone (not just car nuts). In my opinion GTiRs rule and scoobies sux


WizzBang

(that should get a few replies ;P)

[Edited by Wizzbang - 5/24/2002 11:50:39 PM]

gravelexpress

yup coming on a scooby board and sayin they suck does tend to provoke people..
anyway whats the address for the GTIR register/web board thing?

so we abuse you back ha!

no seriously i might consider one of these if i can find out more. yes i have raced one(wrx 96) and had no problems whatsover must have been a stock example though.

Bruiser.STi

Wizz- A sorted STi will eat 4.7 0-60....
Read Banzai and the scooby test...Craig H got 12.3 quarter and 9.9 seconds to 100mph.....
AS for eating subies on the road....you obviously have never run into a decent one who's willing to show you a thing or two....
And it will take more than a little boost to go from 13.6 to the 12 second bracket....Unless of course you get a Subie...

Surry

Regarding how much boost it will take to get into the twelves in a gtir, all you need is a filter and exhaust and the boost can then go up to 1 bar, which is more than enough to get a decent driver into the late twelves on a well setup car, for about 500 quids worth of mods, thats not much is my opinon, a damn site less than a scooby would cost to get into the twelves, your looking at say 4500 for the car and the mods on top so say 5000 gbp, you carnt get one of those ****e wagon scoobies for that, let alone a fast one.

Also you mention craig hardcastles car but that was the only fast car in that banzai mag, where were all the others?

Bruiser.STi

Surry- If you think that a GTiR with a n exhaust, filter and 1 bar is goin to drop into the 12 sec bracket, I would love to see it. As for a standard WRX getting into the 12 sec bracket that is a tall order. But an STi doesnt need much to break in, as noted above a V5 Type R in the 12's with little mods....
I maintain that the difference between 13.5 and a 12 sec pass is a lot. Not just a quick boost increase.....
I know of a few GTiR's which were running at a drag meet yesterday here which have, front mount, link cpu, exhaust, filter, injectors, running over 1 bar, and the best time was a 12.98....
A lot more than 500 pounds there.....

Toerag

www.gtir.co.uk
I'm one of caleb's mates

skiddusmarkus

I went to the pod yesterday in the hope of seeing some scoobs up against some gtirs and only one turned up.There was also only one evo(Makkinen edition)which was a bit disappointing.It was rained off anyway so we'll have to compare at a later date.
As I said before,I'm expecting low 13secs to high 12secs at just 1.1bar and I don't think that's dreaming as my car is significantly quicker now than my last runs.Remember the type R has a much lower ratio box than the gtir(which will theoretically top out at 160mph)so it's like having an extra 50bhp.There's also a gtir versionn with a close ratio box called the Dakar,but I've never seen one race so don't know the times.The best I've seen a modified scoob run was mid 13secs at York,obviously there are going to be some quicker but loads of gtirs do that without breaking into a sweat.I'm not here to slate scoobs as I like them but to merely point out that there are other quick(er)cars out there....even if they do look like a brick.

Fizzy

Bruiser,
A guy called Grant on the GTi-R list ran a 12:59 qtr and a 4.1 0-60mph. All he has in the way of mods is 1bar boost, front mount intercooler, exhaust & filter. He's also on 17" rims, which aren't ideal for sprinting.

Bruiser.STi

Fizzy- slightly more than 500's worth of mods.......
The Banzai article on all the Sunny's had the fastest at 12.8 or 12.9, funny how they have spent lots of money and not achieved this....
Im content in the fact that my road car can still beat GTiR rally cars in our car club, in Hill climbs and bent sprints..
And it looks a lot better doin it too......

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

You know that i always thought that anything over 1bar of boost in a GTiR was pushing your luck before its engine goes bang!
I also thought that 300bhp was about the limit before the engine needed some serious work on it to get the best out of it, ie uprated internals, injectors etc.
If you had the 3 similar cars in the class (rally monsters for the road) then at the bottom of the list would be the GTiR for tuning ability, the next would be the scoob and top would be the Evo. If you look at the sort of power to get mid 12's 1/4 miles in a scoob then compare the same for a GTiR you are going to be looking at one with over 340bhp. Craig H's STI5 wasnt running full boost when he did his 11.3sec 1/4mile, also its had a hell of alot of work done to it and the engine is better and more tunable out of the box than the nissans, that said, for cheap performance you probably cant beat a GTiR but they are not the most reliable of cars and need alot of work to get them upto the std of a uk car yet alone a jap scoob in handling/stopping/performance ability (just ask Rich Wild how much 100bhp+ worth of tuning cost him on his MY96 UK turbo, think it was 1500 quid ) now get that for a nissan GTiR, not a chance!

Tony

GTiR350

Well we have both a GTiR and Wrx STI type RA on our drive.
Has bin like that for 3/4 years now.

I KNOW which one is faster

Dave

skiddusmarkus

Gtir-standard-220bhp
Mix in a front mounted i/c-approx£800
Add a mongoose exhaust £386
A little bit of Blitz filter £180
Finally,a soupcon of bleed valve £ 20
Total £1386



Result-333bhp.Over 100bhp more for less than £1500.The SR20DET engine is good for an easy 300bhp and will run high 12secs-low 13secs with a decent driver.

skiddusmarkus

Bruiser,a better comparison was in an older Banzai/Jap performance where two DP tuned cars were put against each other.The STI was marginally quicker,only losing out on gearing.
The quickest car of the sunny day by far was Jason Gant's(the same car as above)and put in a storming 0-100(only ran once),despite knackering second in the process.He's way over the limit for a standard gearbox though.

nisr227

Actually for a GtiR to be reliable then it shouldn't run more that 1 bar everyday, but you can run up to 1.2 (which can be as much as 320bhp if its a good one) providing you have the fuel set-up spot on with a device like the Apexi Fuel Controller, above this and its a must to have forged pistons.

I was at the Banzai day and the 400bhp quoted car had fuel and 2nd gear problems, so the boost was reduced, but it wasn't anywhere near 400bhp, more like 350bhp becuase he was running a standard box, it would of eaten it if he was, the slow 4.6 0-60 shows how easy he went off the line before doing a 9.8 second 0-100. The conditions were very poor on the day and a most were backing off before the 1/4 mile was up, we couldn't see **** all for some time. The Gtir's used were not the best around either and they didn't even contact the GTiROC! Bit of a farse really.

There will be some very fast R's around this summer, keep an eye out at the sprints, i'm sure over the 1/4 mile we'll see GtiRs setting the majority of quicker times.

If you look after the car, have the knowlegde on how to modify it the correct way, and have it setup correctly, then it will be reliable. No cars are perfect, even Sti's have a melting 3rd cylinder problem.

LG John

I don't care how fast a GTI-R is, they look ****!! You can't compare a nice UK scooby to a bucket like that, if you buy the GTI-R surely your only interested in how fast it can go. I'm interested in the scooby for its practicality, all weather ability, looks, comfort (for a fast car), and of course performance - it's a full bag of tricks.

Bruiser.STi

Skiddus- You better add some money in there for Clutch and gearbox, cause a GTiR aint gonna withstand 12 second passes with a standard drivetrain, don't matter how good the driver is....To launch a car hard is always gonna wreck the clutch, unless your talking just the one off.....

skiddusmarkus

Bruiser-true about the clutch and gearbox.Mine's had 3 years of constant fast starts and I had to replace the clutch just before christmas(HKS so add £370+fitting) and the gearbox is on it's way out.It's 11 years old though so it's not done that badly.This applies to any make of car though,not just bag of ****e gtirs(quote saxo boy).I'm looking at a 1/2 dog box with low ratios similar to a type R's so it will be even quicker and no fear of blowing the box.I think one of the main reasons the type R's are so quick is because of the low ratio box so it's not really a true comparison as the standard gtir is geared for around 160mph at 7500rpm in top as opposed to 130ish in the type R.Incidently,the owner of the garage that fitted my clutch had a type R and he reckoned mine was quicker.When he had it unichipped at a well known tuner,no.3 piston let go very quickly and he had to rebuild it himself and was so pissed off that he sold it.That was only at about 16psi.
I know a gtir owner who has had gtir then a type R in the past and said the type R handles better but he then went back to a gtir as in his opinion they are more tunable.

Bruiser.STi

I have heard nothing but bad things about the Unichip....probably why the car blew up.....
I would say that any cars are tunable.....a type R has lots of room for improvement, hence the local guy running 504bhp in his....Its all a matter of how far you want to go....
I will be spending about 1300 of your pounds shortly and coming out with a tidy result of 210kw at the wheels....thats about 60kw above standard, and thats without exceeding factory boost settings....So I would say there is a certain amount of tuning scope there....
AS for 130mph...I can assure you they will go quicker.....closer to 140-145mph....

GTiR350

I dont think they look that bad do they ?

http://www.geocities.com/ax_gtuk/mycar/top.JPG

http://www.geocities.com/ax_gtuk/mycar/front3.JPG

http://www.geocities.com/ax_gtuk/mycar/front6.JPG

Well I dont think so.

nisr227

Mean looking R that, and a nice ND 350bhp conversion to boot.

I fully agree that the gearbox is the a real weak point and as long as you aware that you need to change it for big power (over 320bhp+) then you'll be ok. But for upto 290bhp they are a bargain. And doesn't any 4wd car eat clutchs and even gearboxes if you slaughter it off the line all the time?

I know a bloke with a genuine 400bhp Evo6 (as modified by RC Developments) and even he stated that the gearbox was the only real weakpoint that will cause major problems, but he also said if a decent one was fitted (about £1500) then a 400bhp GtiR was quicker than his Evo, over the 1/4 mile anyway. As I said, i'm confident that that the GtiRs will set the majority of the fast times at sprints against the Evos and Scoobs this year, and of course at "10 of the best", we'll have to wait and see...

But if you have loads and loads of money then the best rally type car will always be the evo6, i can't believe the power some of the highly modified ones produce (nearly 600bhp!), awesome. Or a tuned Skyline (give me a few years) if you can live with the larger size.

skiddusmarkus

Bruiser,is that with an increased rev limit?What are you having done to increase the power at the wheels by that much..making it rear wheel drive?

ash1

iTrader: (2)

In one of my mad moments last week (they don't happen too often as I am a mature geezer now - well supposed to be anyway) I had a K reg Nissan GTI R besides me. We were neck and neck in a straight line in my P1? In the end I let him cut me up as there was a long line of traffic ahead and I didn't want to take any risks... impressive though (in a straight line that is)

moses

yeah mate their very very fast, sometimes hard to beat those tuned up ones, hopefully i will be racing one soon at crail me and my mate dave, i have an evo, his is getting tuned up to hell

skiddusmarkus

Yo moses,if you ver get down to one of the Englis meets,I'll race your evo in mine.God bless

Bruiser.STi

skiddusmarkus- By my calc. 130 mph is only 208 kph.....and the car will rev out too redline in top.....It does 170 in fourth.
I have had mine off the clock and back towards the 0 on the speedo...at least 225 kph. The 22B is quoted as having a top of 145mph....and the Type R's have the same gearing if Im not mistaken.

As for my mods...its a mod called a twisted turbo. It realigns all your existing set-up to optimise the turbo performance.
Makes the intake-turbo-exhaust one compact unit. Similar to a WRC set up. Needs a new fuel pump to handle the increase in flow though. There are about 5 cars with it already done and all are achieving over 200kw at the wheels with no more than 1 Bar of boost. Will post some dyno figures and graphs once its all complete.....