american oppression
07 January 2003, 09:49 AM
#1
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jye
i'd say you were deliberately missing a very important point here.
no-one denies that it's pretty easy to obtain a firearm legally in the US. (but then again, it's pretty easy to obtain an automatic firearm in the UK illegally. just ask the mother of letitia shakespeare).
moore manipulates to portray his own interpretation of reality rather than portraying reality itself.
you say 'artistic licence?' what possible role can artistic licence have in a documentary? it's a genre that relies on the accurate holding up of a mirror to society and its problems.
a documentary that uses artistic licence is not a documentary - it is just a subjective record of personal belief.
what would you say if panorama was to use 'artistic licence' to portray palestinians in a deliberate, negatively manipulated way to make a pro-israeli political point? i suspect you'd be pretty goddamned unhappy about it...
[Edited by Holy Ghost - 7/1/2003 9:50:45 AM]
i'd say you were deliberately missing a very important point here.
no-one denies that it's pretty easy to obtain a firearm legally in the US. (but then again, it's pretty easy to obtain an automatic firearm in the UK illegally. just ask the mother of letitia shakespeare).
moore manipulates to portray his own interpretation of reality rather than portraying reality itself.
you say 'artistic licence?' what possible role can artistic licence have in a documentary? it's a genre that relies on the accurate holding up of a mirror to society and its problems.
a documentary that uses artistic licence is not a documentary - it is just a subjective record of personal belief.
what would you say if panorama was to use 'artistic licence' to portray palestinians in a deliberate, negatively manipulated way to make a pro-israeli political point? i suspect you'd be pretty goddamned unhappy about it...
[Edited by Holy Ghost - 7/1/2003 9:50:45 AM]
07 January 2003, 11:24 AM
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no, i don't dismiss every point he makes but i take much of what he says with the large pinch of salt one needs to give to someone who is a highly politicised and factually unreliable journalist/film-maker.
to be fair & for all their problems, the US has been - and remains - an aspirational magnet to millions of immigrants-***-citizens who take loyalty to their adopted country very seriously. as long as it remains the richest country on the planet, this will remain the case. for better and for worse, you only have to look at the country's extraordinary and large scale racial mix to realise that.
should they set an example? can any country set an individual example? i'd say not because self-interest will always queer the pitch for somebody, somwhere, somehow.
not wishing to sound poncey but the only example man can set to man is the fundamental right to freedom of - and respect for - the individual. and that's a universal responsibility.
[Edited by Holy Ghost - 7/1/2003 11:25:16 AM]
to be fair & for all their problems, the US has been - and remains - an aspirational magnet to millions of immigrants-***-citizens who take loyalty to their adopted country very seriously. as long as it remains the richest country on the planet, this will remain the case. for better and for worse, you only have to look at the country's extraordinary and large scale racial mix to realise that.
should they set an example? can any country set an individual example? i'd say not because self-interest will always queer the pitch for somebody, somwhere, somehow.
not wishing to sound poncey but the only example man can set to man is the fundamental right to freedom of - and respect for - the individual. and that's a universal responsibility.
[Edited by Holy Ghost - 7/1/2003 11:25:16 AM]
07 January 2003, 05:42 PM
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scandinavia more advanced than japan???
Jye you need to get better sources than that tinpot source
i truly think you are thick making that kind of assertion lol.
I despair for you and symapthise greatly with your poor loved ones
[Edited by StiShrek - 7/1/2003 5:43:41 PM]
Jye you need to get better sources than that tinpot source
i truly think you are thick making that kind of assertion lol.
I despair for you and symapthise greatly with your poor loved ones
[Edited by StiShrek - 7/1/2003 5:43:41 PM]
25 June 2003, 01:43 PM
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With darkness shrouding the Iraqi capital once again and turning it into a city daunted by fear, Iraqis charge that the U.S.-led occupation authority deliberately cut off electricity and water as a collective punishment in retaliation for mounting resistance attacks, which have become more organized as recently admitted by U.S civilian administrator Paul Bremer.
U.S. troops had claimed that some power-generating stations were "sabotaged or detonated."
But an Iraqi source, who requested anonymity, told IslamOnline.net that the occupation administration decided to cut off electricity for five days in a bid to incite Baghdadis against those who carry out resistance operations against its troops.
Baghdadis have also confirmed that the American forces have emblazoned "Electricity for Peace" on tanks and military vehicles, which pace the Iraqi capital up and down and even on walls.
Outage
The occupation authority further cut off water supplies across Baghdad for the second consecutive, pretending that the power outage had caused the cut-offs.
Thousands of Iraqi children and women flocked to wells dug up by the ousted regime authorities across Baghdad before the U.S.-led troops rolled into the capital on April 9 to store up water.
Many Iraqi families set up manual water pumps in the gardens of their houses to provide them themselves with unpurified water.
"Is this what the U.S. administration has promised us more darkness and water outage? " Hassan Thamir al-Ani, an Iraqi citizen, wondered.
"Even during the U.S.-led invasion we were never deprived of our electricity and water. But outages started immediately with the U.S. occupation," he complained in statements to IOL correspondent.
"The Iraqi people are adamant and would never yield to threats or blackmail," he averred.
"The American provocations will only fan the anger of the Iraqis. It has been almost two months now and we have not yet felt secure. We barely eke out our livings and it seems as if things are going from bad to worse," al-Ani stressed.
"Iraqis should be happy with the satellite dishes brought by the U.S.," rocked Fatemah Mohammad, an Iraqi woman.
"Thousands of Iraqi breadwinners have been laid off…And why this power outage? They want to punish fedayeen (Iraqi fighters) who attack U.S. troops, but the entire Iraqi people will become fedayeen if these provocations persist," she threatened.
"Ice sheets have become much sought-after and its prices have skyrocketed in two days' time from 750 dinars per sheet to 8000 ($6) as temperatures hit 45 Celsius," said Alawi Gomah, an ice-sheet seller.
Khwla Abdul Kareem, a teacher, echoed the same desperate feelings.
"Power has been never cut off abruptly for two consecutive days. Don't they feel for our children? They have exams now and are in a dire need for concentration," she roared.
"Our sufferings snowballs hour in and hour out. With water outage we can't even use the bathroom. It is terrible and I expect the Iraqi people will run out of patience tomorrow (Thursday, June 26) if these appalling conditions persisted," said the school teacher.
Summing up the predominant feelings among Baghdadis, Abu Maissa highlighted the widespread resentment at the U.S. schemes.
"Are Iraqis predestined to trade something for another? Yesterday, we traded oil for food, today it is peace for electricity and water and tomorrow might be slavery for life."
In a further demonstration of the mounting resistance attacks, a huge explosion rocked the Republican Palace in Baghdad, the headquarters of the U.S. administration, Monday, June 23, in one of the most ferocious attacks targeting U.S. troops since U.S. President George W. Bush had declared the war on Iraq was effectively over on May 1.
On Tuesday, June 24, a U.S. military convoy was ambushed in the main ring road of al-Youssifia, leaving two vehicles at least destroyed.
However, there were no reports about U.S. causalities from the attack, but eyewitnesses said it left a number of U.S. soldiers killed.
They asserted that U.S. troops rushed to the scene in a rescue and evacuation operation and set up roadblocks for more than four hours.
-
U.S. troops had claimed that some power-generating stations were "sabotaged or detonated."
But an Iraqi source, who requested anonymity, told IslamOnline.net that the occupation administration decided to cut off electricity for five days in a bid to incite Baghdadis against those who carry out resistance operations against its troops.
Baghdadis have also confirmed that the American forces have emblazoned "Electricity for Peace" on tanks and military vehicles, which pace the Iraqi capital up and down and even on walls.
Outage
The occupation authority further cut off water supplies across Baghdad for the second consecutive, pretending that the power outage had caused the cut-offs.
Thousands of Iraqi children and women flocked to wells dug up by the ousted regime authorities across Baghdad before the U.S.-led troops rolled into the capital on April 9 to store up water.
Many Iraqi families set up manual water pumps in the gardens of their houses to provide them themselves with unpurified water.
"Is this what the U.S. administration has promised us more darkness and water outage? " Hassan Thamir al-Ani, an Iraqi citizen, wondered.
"Even during the U.S.-led invasion we were never deprived of our electricity and water. But outages started immediately with the U.S. occupation," he complained in statements to IOL correspondent.
"The Iraqi people are adamant and would never yield to threats or blackmail," he averred.
"The American provocations will only fan the anger of the Iraqis. It has been almost two months now and we have not yet felt secure. We barely eke out our livings and it seems as if things are going from bad to worse," al-Ani stressed.
"Iraqis should be happy with the satellite dishes brought by the U.S.," rocked Fatemah Mohammad, an Iraqi woman.
"Thousands of Iraqi breadwinners have been laid off…And why this power outage? They want to punish fedayeen (Iraqi fighters) who attack U.S. troops, but the entire Iraqi people will become fedayeen if these provocations persist," she threatened.
"Ice sheets have become much sought-after and its prices have skyrocketed in two days' time from 750 dinars per sheet to 8000 ($6) as temperatures hit 45 Celsius," said Alawi Gomah, an ice-sheet seller.
Khwla Abdul Kareem, a teacher, echoed the same desperate feelings.
"Power has been never cut off abruptly for two consecutive days. Don't they feel for our children? They have exams now and are in a dire need for concentration," she roared.
"Our sufferings snowballs hour in and hour out. With water outage we can't even use the bathroom. It is terrible and I expect the Iraqi people will run out of patience tomorrow (Thursday, June 26) if these appalling conditions persisted," said the school teacher.
Summing up the predominant feelings among Baghdadis, Abu Maissa highlighted the widespread resentment at the U.S. schemes.
"Are Iraqis predestined to trade something for another? Yesterday, we traded oil for food, today it is peace for electricity and water and tomorrow might be slavery for life."
In a further demonstration of the mounting resistance attacks, a huge explosion rocked the Republican Palace in Baghdad, the headquarters of the U.S. administration, Monday, June 23, in one of the most ferocious attacks targeting U.S. troops since U.S. President George W. Bush had declared the war on Iraq was effectively over on May 1.
On Tuesday, June 24, a U.S. military convoy was ambushed in the main ring road of al-Youssifia, leaving two vehicles at least destroyed.
However, there were no reports about U.S. causalities from the attack, but eyewitnesses said it left a number of U.S. soldiers killed.
They asserted that U.S. troops rushed to the scene in a rescue and evacuation operation and set up roadblocks for more than four hours.
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25 June 2003, 07:18 PM
#8
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Moses
Quote
"i hope the soldiers get their **** kicked and sent back and some of the evil ones in body bags"
----------------------------------------------------------------
You do yourself no favours and belittle the point of your thread posting inflamatory and derogatory remarks like this, perhaps it is you showing your true colours,, either way is does no one any good.
wrxstiman
Qoute
"got more in common with an american living next door than an iraqi kurd!"
---------------------------------------------
If you really feel this way then mores the pity!
[Edited by Paul Habgood - 6/25/2003 7:20:53 PM]
Quote
"i hope the soldiers get their **** kicked and sent back and some of the evil ones in body bags"
----------------------------------------------------------------
You do yourself no favours and belittle the point of your thread posting inflamatory and derogatory remarks like this, perhaps it is you showing your true colours,, either way is does no one any good.
wrxstiman
Qoute
"got more in common with an american living next door than an iraqi kurd!"
---------------------------------------------
If you really feel this way then mores the pity!
[Edited by Paul Habgood - 6/25/2003 7:20:53 PM]
25 June 2003, 08:45 PM
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It is called cultural identity mr habgood.
tribal instinct that exists everywhere
dont start playing the race-card...you of all ppl.
Think you have joined the lily-livered liberals with your PC comments...or perhaps a NIMBI (everything is fine as long as it is not in my backyard!)
tribal instinct that exists everywhere
dont start playing the race-card...you of all ppl.
Think you have joined the lily-livered liberals with your PC comments...or perhaps a NIMBI (everything is fine as long as it is not in my backyard!)
25 June 2003, 10:23 PM
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hope the soldiers get their **** kicked and sent back and some of the evil ones in body bags..................................
moses your not british your a peace of **** you sit at home in GREAT BRITON all nice and comfy and here you are saying you want our troops to be killed i personaly think your a muslim fanatic who should be put back to his roots in a nice place like afganistan palistine or iraq were you feckin belong you sure as hell dont belong or desurve to live here.
moses your not british your a peace of **** you sit at home in GREAT BRITON all nice and comfy and here you are saying you want our troops to be killed i personaly think your a muslim fanatic who should be put back to his roots in a nice place like afganistan palistine or iraq were you feckin belong you sure as hell dont belong or desurve to live here.
25 June 2003, 10:25 PM
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Habgood your about as impartial as a flippin non-impartial type of person...suprised that they get sum1 like u moderating...ooh u gona reply wth a realy long reply now?and yes my speling ****e.
26 June 2003, 08:21 AM
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WRXSTIMAN, i see where you are coming from, I misread your comment, maybee feeling a bit touchy. Agree, i do not speak Kurd or understand their way of life and have little in common.
as for your comment "Think you have joined the lily-livered liberals with your PC comments...or perhaps a NIMBI (everything is fine as long as it is not in my backyard!)"
Hardy, i think you'll find it's more a case of not in anyones back yard for me. I want the best for the UK and it's subjects, have you read my posts on the 'Riots in Wales' thread???
Turboman
It's Mr Habgood to the likes of you BTW
No long reply as for your spelling, who cares - its what you mean that is of interest to me.
I hope my modding is impartial, i am allowed to have my own feelings and opinions mind and if that was to stifled by my modding then i would give it up. Yes, i have strong views on some subjects and i like to think i have a good sense of what is right and wrong. Nothing wrong with that.
BTW your comment on the Fearon thread i started "If criminals have the same rights as everyone else how the hell can this further society?
Tis the beginning of the end"
I could not agree more with this sentiment, the law is there to and must protect the innocent not the dregs of our siociety.
Moses comment was well out of order.
WRXSTIMANS comment was taken out of context by me for which i apologise, sh*t happens. No hidden agenda.
[Edited by Paul Habgood - 6/26/2003 8:25:24 AM]
[Edited by Paul Habgood - 6/26/2003 8:40:34 AM]
as for your comment "Think you have joined the lily-livered liberals with your PC comments...or perhaps a NIMBI (everything is fine as long as it is not in my backyard!)"
Hardy, i think you'll find it's more a case of not in anyones back yard for me. I want the best for the UK and it's subjects, have you read my posts on the 'Riots in Wales' thread???
Turboman
It's Mr Habgood to the likes of you BTW
No long reply as for your spelling, who cares - its what you mean that is of interest to me.
I hope my modding is impartial, i am allowed to have my own feelings and opinions mind and if that was to stifled by my modding then i would give it up. Yes, i have strong views on some subjects and i like to think i have a good sense of what is right and wrong. Nothing wrong with that.
BTW your comment on the Fearon thread i started "If criminals have the same rights as everyone else how the hell can this further society?
Tis the beginning of the end"
I could not agree more with this sentiment, the law is there to and must protect the innocent not the dregs of our siociety.
Moses comment was well out of order.
WRXSTIMANS comment was taken out of context by me for which i apologise, sh*t happens. No hidden agenda.
[Edited by Paul Habgood - 6/26/2003 8:25:24 AM]
[Edited by Paul Habgood - 6/26/2003 8:40:34 AM]
26 June 2003, 08:45 AM
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Turbowhatever
I am sure you are right and many thanks for improving my knowlege of the world's languages if this is the case. I just cut and pasted it from another post or is it i have got ya goat and you want to have a go.
I get the impression of you that that if our our views differ then i should keep silent, unlucky!
Sorry to drag this off topic, hopefully it will get back on.
[Edited by Paul Habgood - 6/26/2003 8:52:18 AM]
I am sure you are right and many thanks for improving my knowlege of the world's languages if this is the case. I just cut and pasted it from another post or is it i have got ya goat and you want to have a go.
I get the impression of you that that if our our views differ then i should keep silent, unlucky!
Sorry to drag this off topic, hopefully it will get back on.
[Edited by Paul Habgood - 6/26/2003 8:52:18 AM]
26 June 2003, 08:48 AM
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"It is called cultural identity mr habgood.
tribal instinct that exists everywhere
dont start playing the race-card...you of all ppl.
Think you have joined the lily-livered liberals with your PC comments...or perhaps a NIMBI (everything is fine as long as it is not in my backyard!)"
You are obsessed with race and anyone who disagrees with you is automatically "playing the race card".
We have very little in common with the Americans and if you think we do then that's a shame as their society is exremely dysfunctional. In fact their society is killing our planet, alienating most of the people that live on it and if it came down to it they would stab us (the UK) in the back without a second thought- great friends.
tribal instinct that exists everywhere
dont start playing the race-card...you of all ppl.
Think you have joined the lily-livered liberals with your PC comments...or perhaps a NIMBI (everything is fine as long as it is not in my backyard!)"
You are obsessed with race and anyone who disagrees with you is automatically "playing the race card".
We have very little in common with the Americans and if you think we do then that's a shame as their society is exremely dysfunctional. In fact their society is killing our planet, alienating most of the people that live on it and if it came down to it they would stab us (the UK) in the back without a second thought- great friends.
26 June 2003, 01:40 PM
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Moses
Don't give me the body bag routine. I did 13 years mate in the Army and got shot and nearly blown to feckin pieces.
Most of your posts are good alternatives to the mainstream armchair Light Ale Cavaliers on here who watch Platoon and beleive they would have belonged in The 'Nam.
Don't belittle it with juandiced dogma
Don't give me the body bag routine. I did 13 years mate in the Army and got shot and nearly blown to feckin pieces.
Most of your posts are good alternatives to the mainstream armchair Light Ale Cavaliers on here who watch Platoon and beleive they would have belonged in The 'Nam.
Don't belittle it with juandiced dogma
26 June 2003, 01:56 PM
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dais u didnt read me properly i said the bad soldiers i didnt say the good ones, i said the trigger happy arseholes wanna be bruce willis c;onts who oppress people they should be sent in bodybags
26 June 2003, 02:00 PM
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Moses
Oh you mean Mother Marine and her Green Killing Machine
OK, but not body bags, no one on either side deserves that.
Seen to much in the flesh to condone that mate
Oh you mean Mother Marine and her Green Killing Machine
OK, but not body bags, no one on either side deserves that.
Seen to much in the flesh to condone that mate
26 June 2003, 03:04 PM
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lol thats what i mean bros
body bags yeah for all evil folk
daiscooby your cool keep it that way mate
even if i get a lil extreme i dont mean harm to anyone except scumbags
body bags yeah for all evil folk
daiscooby your cool keep it that way mate
even if i get a lil extreme i dont mean harm to anyone except scumbags
26 June 2003, 07:55 PM
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moses, 'scared' people often behave like this, watch Bowling for Columbine', now thats whats happening in the 'real' world that these [/b]Narrow-minded[/b] idiots forget
27 June 2003, 03:48 PM
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Holy Ghost I have visited all the moorewatch sites etc. I also think that he got 'most' of the facts correct in Bowling for Columbine. OK so perhaps Lockheed were misrepresented, and perhaps a few dates of the NRA 'rallies' were wrong etc.
But banks giving you a gun for opening an account, barbers and supermarkets selling 9mm ammo, come on!
The comparison with Canada also says a lot about the ‘scared’ people of the USA.
But banks giving you a gun for opening an account, barbers and supermarkets selling 9mm ammo, come on!
The comparison with Canada also says a lot about the ‘scared’ people of the USA.