Jacko

My car is a UK MY97,it has a Link ECU, VF23 Turbo, STi5 TMICooler (inc. alu Y-Piece), HKS iridium plugs, Scoobysport Full sys, blah blah blah...
Last night I couldn't out gun a UK MY98 with PPP!
I do not condone Boy racer antics, but I was interested to see whether my money has been well spent. To say I am a little disappointed would be an understatement!!!
Before I took the plunge with above hardware I also considered Unichip + boost controller, Motec and more importantly UK MY97 PPP!
I was strongly advised against it on this BBS, but I know have my doubts to whether I have made the right choices.
Does anyone have any experience of UK MY97/98 PPP?

Disgruntled, Jacko

P.S. Nice/quick motor John Moore...well done, I am jealous

Danny Fisher

Jacko, I tried a PPP in my UK MY97, I even had it on the rollers, and it showed some funny power 'SHORTAGES' above 5,500 rpm.

In my opion you have spent the money well. By the time you have had the unichip with boost controller fitted you are looking at about the link price tag. As for the motec that is an almost different world. It gives better definition for the map.

Stick with it, speak to Bob, see what he can do to help.

Dan

catflap

Sounds daft, but remembre that on most conditions 0-60ish, it could be down to gear chenges as well

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Got to admit that my MY00 PPP doesnt show any power shortages she still pulls 200bhp@7k and around 160-180lbs of torque
You have to look at how the PPP is mapped thou, at between 3.5 and 5.5k my car is great, then she slowly peters off but not drastically (until you go over 7k)
Also my car is a standard PPP one (no extras) she pushes 249bhp and 238lbs of torque (runs on optimax and has 17k on the clock) but i think its just down to the map on the chip, the later PPP's are meant to be better than the earlier ones as the phase 2 engines seem to respond better to it.
The PPP is just a better in gear chip than most, through the gears it would be close in any scoob, just down to how hard you drive your car really.

Tony

Jacko

Hi Danny,
yeah, I remember you saying before about the PPP on a MY97 but I can't help feeling that a well modified MY97 should be considerably quicker than a UK MY98/99/00 with PPP!
To be fair, I am due for a re-map due to small glitch and to map in the new intercooler and dump valve (I think my OEM UK MY97 dump valve was leaking!!!)
Just to add that my post is not directed at anyone for their mapping abilities. I am just trying to understand why I have spent a lot of money on a MY97 car, when I probably should have bought a UK MY98/99/00 with PPP. Was I never going to better the PPP???

Hi Catflap,
I realise that when it comes to the 0-60 times there should be very little in it, as the tdo4 is just as good (if not better!) bottom end and some of the mid range. I do realise that the VF23 will hold higher boost for longer so therefore the upper mid and top end should be far better.

Hi TonyBurns,
PPP'd cars are certainly quick without doubt! I also know that the phase2 engine has less propensity to knock therefore more advance can be obtained. My UK MY97, so I have been told, can handle more advance than many other MY97's and even some MY99/00's that have been worked upon!!!

Does anyone know anyone running a UK MY97 with PPP?

Thanks for the replies, Jacko.

AlexM

Jacko,

Too many variables could be a factor, including driving (no insult intended ), Even if he got a slight jump on you, this could easily account for your experience. Have you never struggled to overtake another car with inferior performance before? This can be very deceptive.

You did mention you haven't had a remap since fitting a an STI 5 intercooler. This is going to make a major difference (lower pressure drop, higher charge density) etc, as the MY97/98 intercooler is a lot less efficient. The MY97/98 PPP has quite a flat torque curve, but never makes as much as your car should if all is well.

The first suggestion would be to have BRD take a 'check ride' to see if there are any issues (especially since you mention a glitch).

The MY97/98 PPP is generally accepted as not being one of the best. CCC magazine published comparison performance figures before/after PPP conversion, and the standard car was only fractionally slower all-out in a straight line. This is probably due to the reduction in boost above 5.5k that Tony mentioned (this is also done on MY97/98 cars). Even the in-gear performance tests the difference wasn't great.

I have a standard acceleration test from rest to max speed reached by a landmark. fitting the link improved my terminal speed by about 15mph!. Torque has improved by 40lb/ft too, which sounds like good tuning VFM to me.

There is no way you should fail to improve on a PPP car. Prodrive have no mystical powers that circumvent the laws of thermodynamics. Why do you think a MY98 car (with PPP) should be any better than yours? The engine is identical, and the PPP is VERY conservative (especially for our cars). The differences with the Phase 2 (99&gt PPPs are significant though.

My advice would be to get in touch with BRD re: a remap, and not to be disgruntled because you failed to crush the opposition on one occasion .

Cheers,

Alex

Jacko

Thanks for the reply Alex.
Good info and I see that the numerous variables could be attributed to my disgruntlement
I will hope to be seeing a mapper v.soon.
Post this posting, I have found out that the MY98 PPP in question is a very very good example of a PPP'd car. Apparently it has on previous occasions, been seen yapping at the heels of an STi6. One time was upto Scotland just recently.

Not so Disgruntled now, Jacko ( But as someone's email pointed out - I will never be happy, no matter how much money I could spend on my car )