Fuzz

sometimes mine flickers all the way to the red light, I pointed this out to the mapper and he assured me it was just engine noise,
(in my case)
But it did make some nasty noises If I changed gear too quick
(i.e, it was detting for real)
(sounded like a playing card in the spokes of a bike wheel for a split second)
Apparently I was getting back on boost above 5500rpm after a gear change at 6400rpm
bloody quick gear change = hitting parts of map that are not usually hit
all sorted now though..

In essence, even having the red light come on MAYnot mean it's detting (yes I have it on max sensitivity) You'll here it, if it does (well I did anyway)


Andy

Triple X

iTrader: (1)

When i fitted mine i was getting the red LED quite often which i cured by remaoving the HKS induction kit and fitting the more restrictive air box and k+n panel filter. Now it rarly blips second green LED, infact i checked to see if the sensor was still working to be sure!

RT

Interesting topic of discussion this.

I have heard very light det even with 1 or 2 greens showing only - just one or two flicks of a light card. But more often, I don't heard anything with 1 or 2 greens.

Does this mean its detting? Many opinions have been stated before. Believe Pete Croney once said that the KL will light up its big Red LED at the slightest sign of genuine det. Others I know also see 2 greens or 1 amber quite frequently.

I do think the KL is a bit of an "overkill" on max sensitivity. But having said that, if you do see the Red often, further attention is warranted.

scoootie5

Thanks for the replys.

Seems I am not the only one then.

I put my boost down to 1bar and tried it today, and the caution light did not come on but a quick flash of the RED did. Do I assume this is just engine noise or a quick det.
Is this going to cause me problems if I do get a quick det?

I think I will be buying the Walbro Fuel pump to be on the safe side, So with my Sti intercooler and a Walbro f/pump I should be safe as houses at 1.3bar??

Just wondering how much boost is safe on standard internals?

Cheers
Scott

Nezz10

I have a knocklink fitted with the Link ECU and I usually get 2 green and one red when starting the engine. When driving about I get infrequent flashes of the second red when changing gear whilst the boost sorts itself out and flickers of red and maybe even second red when reving through the range down 'private roads'.

NEVER had the big red light up.

Think mine is a little sensitive. Getting a remap tomorrow dur to new turbo so will ask Bob whilst I am there.

Gedi

Which is a good knocklink to buy?

I will be fitting one to an V5 TypeR from which I am expecting to see seme det until I get it mapped.

john banks

Second green on maximum sensitivity flickers at high RPM on a lot of cars. Some may be a bit more or less. The thing to watch for is a sudden spike rather than a gradual progression.

I have never heard det on any car with only the greens showing, although that of course does not mean it couldn't happen. With the oranges you can sometimes just hear a little tick/crisp packet noise, with the red you can usually hear the above louder, but if you were not listening and did not know what to listen for you may completely miss it.

Usually I find it is only 2 degrees or so of ignition timing between an engine which is very quiet on the knocklink to one which is flashing big red and audibly detting when provoked.

I aim to see nothing above the second green ever on my car, and that only over 5500 RPM. If it does any more than that you can get rid of it by either lowering boost, retarding timing or adding fuelling, or alternatively using octane booster or helping breathing/cooling.

The reason I don't approve of boost controllers on imports is because they run a good handful of degrees more ignition advance than UK cars and so are already on the edge.

You need the right combination of fuelling, boost and timing to get good power without det on any given spec of engine. To do this precisely you simply have to remap the ECU to get it right on all loads and engine speeds.

Andy F and Rich Wild amongst others have had fantastic results using the original ECU, but both have now moved onto programmable ECUs for the finesse of control, maximum gains and safety. There is no substitute for getting everything right in every possible situation.

These engines can arguably take silly boost and power if you stop them detting. Have them detting and they will fall to bits at 0.8 bar. Stop them detting and they are likely to hold together with more reliability at double this boost. I am stretching the point a little perhaps? Maybe not.

scoootie5

I have had a little boost about today and have upped the boost again to 1.25bar. I only get the two orange light up for a second and go off again at WOT and they do not seem to come back on again in that gear.

I think the Walbro fuel pump will sort this, which I will be putting in next week.

Will let ya know.
Scott

P.S Thanks for explaining this John.

Bob Rawle

Since engines vary so much in the amount of background noise they generate the only sure way to be certain its just noise is to use det cans and listen and watch, that way you correlate lights to actual det. Steady greens are not det, steady ambers may not be either, flickering up and down the scale into the ambers can be det, the big red flashing is definately det even if its minor.

This all asssumes the knock sensor is on the engine block and the sensitivity is max.

Bob Rawle

Best just get some det cans on it, then you will be sure.

scoootie5

I am assuming the fuel pump is giving up because when I first got my Dawes device and setup to 1.3bar my AFR had a blue light. Now 4 months down the line and the AFR has fallen to the Orange light at WOT. Since I have added my STi intercooler it has not made any difference. Thought at first that my Lambda was faulty but all the lights still go up and down like a christmas tree when changing gear etc ( so the voltage is still changing on the Lambda).
Even when I drop the boost down to 1.1bar my standard ecu setting it still does not go blue at WOT.
So because the AFR has dropped I am assuming that the fuel pressure has dropped on my 9 year old fuel pump.

Det Cans do sound like a good way of finding out properly but who does this sort of thing?

Thanks aging for the replys guys

Scott

john banks

Could also be the lambda sensor slowly dropping its signal on open loop. They tend to do this before they give up working on closed loop. Or you could really be going lean as you say.

scoootie5

Ok that does make sense.

I have bought the fuel pump now and it is arriving on tuesday as I have read in many places the fuel pump is worth changing cos the OE one is barely up to the job. So i shall see.

Thanks for your help it has put my mind at rest for the moment.

Scott

JamesS

The knocklink will react differently when fitted to different engines. Any change in hardware on the engine will change the frequency spectrum of the engine and result in different readings...

As said above only real use would be to correlate the lights with det-cans. But even then it will not be 100%..all IMHO!

scoootie5

Ok so,

I fitted my Knocklink on my MY94 WRX RA lastnight but it was too late to try it so I waited till morning.

I took the revs quite high as I was going along but with only light throttle and the first light flickered. Gave it a Quick blast in 4th, Full throttle and the 2 CAUTION lights came on so I let off the gas and pootled to work.

I guess "caution" is a bad thing so I am a little worried.

I am/was running just under 1.3bar boost with Dawes, have also done:

Blitz SUS induction kit (cold air feed with small scoop)
Turbo back no-Cat SS exhaust
Hks SSQ BOV
Downpipe splitter mod
STi TMIC
Samco's
Polished Heads

Run Optimax + Booster every time

I will be dropping the boost down to 1.2bar and see what happens then. If I want to run higher boost or in summer when its hotter.
Should I go for a Uprated Walbro fuel pump?
Or a Uprated ECU?
OR BOTH????


Would appriciate any comments

Cheers
Scott

Forgot to add that when i got the car it already had a ProVa ecu which is a piggy back, and the boost was at 1.1bar.

[Edited by scoootie5 - 3/6/2003 9:57:54 PM]

john banks

Not disagreeing with Bob in following him here... just throwing in another thought...

Scott, just thinking that the fuel pump may help if your present one is weak or is dropping the fuel pressure and you are going lean. If it is still very rich then you might (I would say assume you are until proven otherwise) be detting lightly (the 2 oranges briefly) because you are running too much ignition advance for your initial boost climb on your engine setup.

In the absence of someone being able to listen for you, I would suggest if you used slightly lower boost or higher octane fuel and if the oranges do not appear in this area again then it probably was the edge of det and you should avoid this situation by adjusting the spec/map to suit.

You can get an idea of the background noise of your engine by running it through the revs at standard boost (assuming all is healthy on the car) or running at slightly less than full throttle where det is less likely and looking at the pattern. I find that I don't get substantially more noise when I am happy with the setup of a car when I go through a gear at WOT than I do at say 75% throttle.

[Edited by john banks - 3/7/2003 11:12:53 PM]