imlach

hi,

Back lawn is dead/dying/crap. Lots of moss etc. Problem is that tree roots coming up through grass so really need to put topsoil on top (about 4") so that new grass has no tree roots in it.

Can I just put topsoil down on top of old grass? Or do I need the lift the crap turf? Can I just weedkill it???

Lifting it would be a pain!!! Easy solution required.

MooseRacer

Interested to know the answer on this one too.

Crush

If you have moss growing, it means that the ground is very wet & has poor drainage. If you were to put a layer of top soil over it, it wouldn't completely solve the drainage problem.

The best thing to do would be to hollow core the lawn a couple of times & sprinkle sand over the lawn, this will break up the heavy soil & improve drainage. It may need done a couple of times though

Crush

No, don't spike it, you need to remove some of the heavy soil & integrate sand into it. Spiking would do more to compact it as opposed to breaking it up.

Go to the garden centre & ask for a hollow core tool. They look like a fork though.

It is heavy work, and raking sand over the lawn is also exhausting, but to just chuck a layer of soil over the current lawn is definitely not the way to do it. I'm a qualified groundsman you know

MooseRacer

Come and sort mine then Crush

imlach

OK. If you are a qualified groundsman....can I ask some more? :-)

Is what I am trying to do a good idea? Should I just rent the machine that lifts turf and put topsoil down instead? Or can I get away with laying 4" of topsoil on top of old grass once I have drainage sorted out?

Crush

Dream on!

imlach

My soil is very rich as well due to it having been a rotting mess for decades!!! Bit of clay as well.....

Crush

Ok, I have to admit, I haven't done much in the way of groundsmanship in a few years. I w*rk in finance now, but I can still remember a few things.

It may be easier to lift the current lawn, put down a layer of sand & top soil. I can't remember the exact amounts. But with those layers, drainage would be improved, because it sounds like you have a clay based lawn at the moment which is bad. The sand & loose top soil would vastly improve that. Then you have to decide what kind of lawn you want, hard wearing or very smooth. Ryegrass/annual meadow grass is usually very hard wearing.

But I would try salvaging the current lawn before trying the above, because It would be a tad more expensive

imlach

trouble is - need to lift lawn to hide tree roots.

Crush

That could be a problem!

Although you could just dig up the lawn, remove the roots & lay a new lawn. It would be convenient to do them both at the same time.

You can hire machines that dig up the turf, but they are quite tricky to use; and if you're just going to throw up the old turf anyway, then it may be best to do it yourself. A rotovator is another option, but they are very heavy, tricky to use machines, I don't like them.

Try doing a search on google or something about rebuilding a lawn. My memory is a bit hazy because i haven't done it for a while and I gave all my college books away

The results will be better if you just rebuild it, but it is a lot of hard work

Nixs

Crush - You're frightening me

Chrisgr31

Well I am not an expert on lawns but in your case I would weedkill the existing lawn, as if the current one is full of moss theres no point lifting it. Are the tree roots in one place ony? If so I would put a layer of sand on it, say an inch thick, and then use a rotavator to mix it with the existing topsoil. The area round the tree roots will have to be done by hand. You can then add the new top-soil to bring the lawn up to the required level adding sand if necessary.

What sort of tree roots are they? If they are cherry trees you will need to take great care to ensure the roots are not damaged, as if they are shoots will sprout up from where the roots are damaged.

However you will need to choose your turf carefully, particularly if the garden is shaded, or the moss will come back

Crush

Sorry, I'll stop now

One last thing though. While I was at college, I built a couple of greens & teeing areas of a local golf course. We must have used about 2-3 tonnes of gravel, sand & soil for one teeing area!

Chrisgr31

Yes but hiring a rotovator will be more fun, and less hard work!

Crush

Yeah, that should do the job

Rotovators are nasty buggers, difficult to control. But rewarding if you know how to use them, they save so much time. You won't need one unless you're digging the lawn up

fast bloke

I'd go with Chris on this - get enough sharp sand from your builders suppliers to cover the entire are at least an inch. (You can't really overdo it) Let fly with a rotovator - get one that will go down at least 8 inches, but if you want really top class stuff you should double dig (by hand :sad: )the entire thing down about 16-18 inches. Add plently of gravel when you are digging over. Flatten it out and on with the new topsoil.


BTW - Not qualified but have been spotted ironing the 'pile' with a snooker table iron

Chrisgr31

I thought the basic paln was to increase the level of the lawn by 4 inches or so, and to improve the drainage. In that case I would have thought there is little point aerating the existing lawn. Do better to dig it up, and insert fill of sand gravel topsoil to bring it up to the new right level?

Mind you I dug up my lawn 2 years ago with te intention of relaying it. Guess what hasn't happened yet! Mind you its a lot easier to look after. Weedkiller every 3 months is a lot easier than cutting the grass every week!

Scoobydick

At the risk of increasing your work load - you really need to sort out your drainage if that is a problem, otherwise in a year or two you are gonna have the moss back on the new lawn too!

jonny32

Depending whats under the lawn ,a rotovator might add to your problems,,I did it on a new house and bought every stone for miles up to the surface..and do it in the summer .jon

imlach

Yes, it is a bit wet and does need better drainage. Was left neglected for years and years with trees overhead ALL of garden!!

hollow core? How big are the cores?
Do you mean just spike it using an fork and fill holes with sand? Or are we talking bigger cores?


[Edited by imlach - 3/6/2003 1:29:18 PM]

imlach

is this what I need?

B&Q link

[Edited by imlach - 3/6/2003 3:36:35 PM]