zero_to60

agree or disagree

The reason why I think it's ****ed is that for many companies the sofware they are running has all the functionality they need....it will run on the existing infrastructure

Sooooo no one one is buying new software........no one is buying new hardware.........companies are getting used to the products and are able to support them in house......more bods have IT skills......more people mean more choice so less money needed to get the right people

IT's FCUKED....(I am crying now)

Badger Stuffer

Nah...... Just a downturn. It always does and has gone in cycles. I recon anout another 9 - 12 moths and then it will pick up again.

IMHO.....

Jason.

beemerboy

do what i do, and unplug a few things for a while!!!!!!!1

oh and stop crying mate!!

bb

zero_to60

seriously though..........I am as bored as **** at the moment....just hoping I'll last out the next round of redundancies

Was in Tesco yesterday thinking I hope I don't end up stacking shelves for £5 an hour

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

I am glad I work for the government, fairly immune from boom/bust but I do miss the extra cash during the boom bits.

zero_to60

only one customer is taking up our new 'evolution' of our product

suppose it's a bit like saying to someone who's got a 355 Spider to p/x for a 360 Spider when times are tough why bother

Diesel

It's generally agreed that the IT guy at work does very little after the initial install and fixing teething probs. He recently went off for 2 weeks and all that happened was a problem printing... He also took the admin password with him - that's a sackable level of job protectionism IMHO when emergency cover was arranged out of house. Imagine if I went on hols and took the key to the OB truck with me... Still, wouldnt be without them though - they are the only buggers in my industry that have ever talked cars to me

camk

Purely aDownturn, right now consolidation and hunkering down is fashionable. I know loads of guys are saying it tough to get a position but its dependent on your skills and flexibility. I've found a new management position in Europe in less than 2 months looking, mainly as I'm happy to be flexible on location. I think a lot of growth area's like new development and implemntations are on hold as business's don't need new Sales or Distribution systems till they get more orders than today. So yes its a downturn but no more than that IMHO.

Best of Luck
Camk

Wurzel

iTrader: (1)

Does this mean your moving then Cammy or are you staying in Wiesbaden???

Steve

stevencotton

A lot of people keep saying it's a downturn and "it'll pick up again in 6-9 months", but people have been saying that for the past 3 years. This is it

GaryK

I think it is a downturn that will improve but think long term its slowly dwindling, as you say companies seem to make do more, look at M$ and their new licensing, they are fully aware that upgrade cycles are lengthening hence the introduction of subscriptions and alot of large enterprises still run NT4 because it does the job.

It's not enough anymore like it used to be for businesses to replace Word 2.0 with Word 6.0 and Office 95 with Office 97 because they thought they were getting more features, I think generally there is less innovation, its just adding bells and whistles but very little substance.

There are now big spenders looking to reduce costs by moving software development overseas where rates are 1/5 of the uk and the US has been using this model successfully for years.

IT has typically been viewed as a cost to a business and not a benefit (perhaps because of high profile disasters) and in my experience all a business is interested in is the cheapest supplier, not necessarily the best quality solution unless you are one of the big players that charges BIG money!

This is all of course IMHO, but hey sure its not all bad, bottom line for me is late 80s early 90s IT was enjoyable, now its just a job that pays all the bills and then some!

Gary

zero_to60

I think there will always be an IT industry....but I think the big jumps in technology manifesting itself in speed are over

I liken it to cars. Years ago 0-60 in 10 secs was quick then you could do it in 7 then 6 then 5 and so on....you can only go so far

Hardware will be replaced as it just get's old and knackered. Newer kit will be replaced when the software that is run on it demands it. In the banking/trading industry I am in, the software meets the requirements of the markets and provides the functionality demanded by the banks. There will need to be some big change in the way the markets function for there to be a requirement to introduce new functionality i.e upgrade to a new version of the software

Businesses view IT as a distress purchase in the same way I regards washing machines, dishwashers....you buy them to do a job...how many people would replace a washing machine that spins as 1500rpms with one that does it in 1800rpms...?? it will be replaced when it breaks

Unless you are an IT nerd a sun box aint sexy, it's there to do a job and while it does it there's no reason to change it

Squizz

I believe the industry has nothing new to offer...

There will be a general up-turn soon, but nothing drastic. The market is now flooded with skilled professionals.

When I started in 1987, most of the population hadn't touched a "computah". Different story now though.

<rant>

This outsourcing abroad is a joke - I worked for a company which outsourced a load of Y2K work to Madras (India ). What we got back was a joke. Supposedly they'd run and tested all the changes - FEK OFF! None of the stuff would even compile!!! [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]

It's like the new call-centres abroad. Yeah, great, really cheap. Except the customer can't understand a fecking word the operator is saying and vice-versa. [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img] [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img] grrrr...

</rant>

stevencotton

My last company (I finished there last week ) outsourced most stuff to Delhi, including a new booking engine which even after a year hasn't even got off the ground. When I left they'd gone back to basic testing, despite it actually being "live" Glad I no longer have to put up with that rubbish.

mwp

my view ...

In banking-IT there are less discretionary projects getting done so less staff needed. But, there are new projects and new technology is being deployed either cos it's run it's life, it's cost effective or we need the bandwidth due to shrinking margins on more commoditised products - e.g. NT4->win2k->winXP or Linux or blade technology.

What is true is that contractor rates, bonuses, vedor prices are coming down. Look at the number of IT contractors or Permies whose compensation has reduced dramatically in the past 2 years and most of them aren't leaving because there isn't an abundance of jobs (less projects being done by fewer staff) and here's the rub ... a lot of them were overpaid in the first place.

Now the overpaid argument is a long one with no satisfactory conclusion, but we all know the reality of comparing a C++ programmer on £500 a day (some were on 700-1000) vs your other skilled workers in other sectors. IT had got greedy with euro, y2k etc and it's now the buyer's turn.

my 2p

*Sonic*

Also helps if your company does leading edge technology like ours does

stevencotton

I'm in my second day at a fast growing start-up working on Europes largest wireless backbone among other things, but just because some companies are doing well doesn't mean the industry is as a whole

*Sonic*

I completly disagree with the Downturn in the IT industry, the company I work for is at its busiest ever time

We are booked out permanently and have been for many months now, and it is like this for at least the forseable future too

Around Sep 11th our company was also incredibly busy, during the time when some companies hung up their cat5 cables

our utilization is supposed to be around 14 days per month, we are currently hitting around 20-25 days a month utilization, and as a result have just taken on two more people

edited to add, ive just been booked out for 60 days work at Ashworth Hospital to do a major email migration

Steve

[Edited by *Sonic* - 5/7/2003 4:59:01 PM]