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Old 08 May 2003, 09:03 AM
  #1  
Badger Stuffer
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DRIVERS are to face a super camera that can net THOUSANDS of speeders every day.

The Government’s Highways Agency have given the go-ahead for the hi-tech, flash-free, digital American devices to be tested next year.

If successful they could spread across the country.

James Baggott, of motoring mag Auto Express, warned last night that the new wave of cameras make the familiar Gatso models — which only work as long as they have film — look like “clockwork technology”.

He said: “They have the potential to catch many more motorists than Gatsos and generate a staggering amount of revenue.

“Digital technology can spend all day capturing speeding motorists. It’s scary.

“I can see many more drivers losing their licences — and their jobs — through these cameras.”

The digital cameras will go on trial on gantries over a variable speed limit section of the M42 near Birmingham next spring.

A system was first tested in Nottingham three years ago. Two devices recorded an average speed between two points — giving drivers a chance to slow down. The new unit is a single camera that captures the speeders in one snap if they approach too fast.

Drivers will not know they have been caught until a fine notice is delivered.

The cameras transmit a stream of images to a control centre for rapid processing involving little manpower.

If a speed limit lowers, controllers at the HQ can signal the camera to catch drivers at the slower level.

The Sun led a campaign for Gatsos — the bane of motorists for a decade — to be painted bright colours. We also argued for them to be used to police accident blackspots and to protect pedestrians — not just to collect fines to boost revenue.

A Highways Agency spokesman said last night: “The digital cameras will measure cars coming towards them against standard white road markings. There will be signs informing drivers of cameras ahead.”

Ministers hope the cameras will help slash road deaths by 40 per cent by 2010.

A spokesman for the Association of Chief Police Officers said: “We have always been in support of speed cameras. From our point of view they cut the number of deaths.”



Jeremy Clarkson says


HOW much more can these people screw out of the poor British motorist?

There’s a new menace every day that I wake up. We’ve got a congestion charge, tolls, road tax and now these blasted super speed cameras.

My mother – a 68-year-old magistrate and school governor – had never been stopped by police for speeding in her life. But in the last couple of years she’s managed to get nine points on her licence – all from damned speed cameras.

There’s no discretion. We are being policed by robots, not human beings.



Source
Old 08 May 2003, 09:24 AM
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SCOOBY TOWERS
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Anybody lend me a tow truck at say around 4 am
Old 08 May 2003, 11:35 AM
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Leslie
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Its getting just too much now [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]
Old 08 May 2003, 11:49 AM
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corradoboy
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Thumbs down

If only they'd plough all that revenue into the actual roads.
Many years ago a new porous tarmac was invented. Because water could actually permeate through it, spray in wet weather conditions was reduced by up to 90%. Braking distances were drastically reduced, and overall adhesion to the road made for better stability and control through corners. Countries which did implement it saw significant reductions in accidents and casualties.
So why is this product not standard issue on all roads in the UK ?
Firstly, it was about twice as expensive as normal tarmac.
Secondly, once down it not only doesn't generate any revenue of its own, but it also reduces other forms of revenue. Think about it. If accident levels are reduced, that means less insurance claims. All subject to VAT. And (this ones a bit far out) lower insurance premiums, subject to VAT and insurance tax.
Third. If they had started using it, under current road maintenance policy we'd have about 87 feet of safer road.

No, much better to implement a system that has little or no effect on accident figures, irritates, penalises and alienates almost every driver in the country (who, incidentaly, are almost all voters (use your vote)) but collect massive revenues on top of all the other extortionate charges imposed on us.

Billy Connolly once said, "The basic desire to become a politician, should barr you for life from ever being one". You get my vote Billy. As you would say, "F*cking highway robbers"
Old 08 May 2003, 03:03 PM
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Butkus
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This place is getting too grim for words. Everyday it's another depressing story. I just don't believe that speed is solely responsible for all these deaths. People are just going to get fed up with all this cr@p and there's going to be hell to pay.
Old 08 May 2003, 03:13 PM
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Many years ago a new porous tarmac was invented. Because water could actually permeate through it, spray in wet weather conditions was reduced by up to 90%. Braking distances were drastically reduced, and overall adhesion to the road made for better stability and control through corners. Countries which did implement it saw significant reductions in accidents and casualties.
So why is this product not standard issue on all roads in the UK ?
Do we have tarmac on the roads in the Uk? All I tend to drive on are lose stone chippings! [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]
Old 08 May 2003, 03:22 PM
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Butkus
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Yes, this country is becoming a shocking place to live - there must be better places in this world?
Old 08 May 2003, 03:27 PM
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Jye
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Dirty number plates, 'Sorry officer the roads are just in such a shocking dirty condition these days'

Dunno what the fine is for dirty plates but it must be less than getting hit 40 times for speeding in one day if your travelling any distance.
Old 08 May 2003, 03:34 PM
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midget1500
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Angry

this really is going too far. who is it that makes these decisions?

they don't give a f**k about road casulaties, it's all about the money - FACT. if it wasn't about the money there would be no fine element when caught speeding, just points. they may say the fine is to fund the system but then again WTF do i pay road tax and other taxes for? and why should non-speeders not pay for the system then. a load of b*****s.

agrhgrhrgrhgrhrgrhgrhrg
Old 09 May 2003, 12:27 PM
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rozzer
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Dear All,
I has been decided by the powers that be that speed kills, true. However if the motoring public were a little more sensible with regards to their manner of driving, accidents would reduce resulting in a reduction of injuries and fatalities. If drivers were a little bit more thoughtful the use of speed cameras may drop because there would be a reduction in revenue. Statistics show that speed limits of 30,40 and 50 are broken more readily than on motorways hence the use of the cameras. Motorways tend to be enforced by laser, which by the way has a range of 1000 metres. Happy motoring
Old 09 May 2003, 02:35 PM
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Dazzler
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Red face

Bros2 - Unfortunately, it looks like they'll be pushing through the need for front number plates on bikes in the not too distant future as well !
Old 09 May 2003, 02:41 PM
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The Zohan
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Angry

Reducing road deaths and accidents is a noble and worthy cause - and makes a great smoke screen for what is in effect stealth tax generation, shame they do not put anywhre near as much effort into catching car thieves, road tax dodgers MOT dodgers, people without licences usually running about in unroadworthy cars and dangerous drivers.

Govenrment are a bunch of ar$e just need the money to fund their poorly country by taxing people theyt know will pay causze they have no choice - *****!
Old 09 May 2003, 02:57 PM
  #13  
22BUK
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Dunno what the fine is for dirty plates but it must be less than getting hit 40 times for speeding in one day if your travelling any distance.
It's currently £1,000, believe it or not!
Old 09 May 2003, 03:32 PM
  #14  
RoadrunnerV2
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Question

I thought you couldn't use digital photos in a court of law because you can easily get experts to alter them so that its very hard to notice the difference?
Old 09 May 2003, 03:46 PM
  #15  
NotoriousREV
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One of my cars currently has no front number plate and it might stay that way
Old 09 May 2003, 03:51 PM
  #16  
Neil Smalley
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Is'nt this system the same as SPECS? SPECS has been used for a while no, but is horredously expensive(like a million quid per set up)
Old 09 May 2003, 04:01 PM
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Huxley
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Angry

Good thought RoadrunnerV2


I think the governmet are a bunch a ***** my self all they say it's all down to speeding what a load of bo77ocks what about educating the ******* that can't drive or the kids that just run out in front of cars even if the driver is doing the speed limit it's his fault, not the little ****** that ran out in front of him.

Or what about the amount of vehicles that are now on the road the more cars that go on the road the deaths there will be, it can't all be down to speed, More vehicles over the years = more deaths don't just blame speeding[img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]

It makes me so fecking angry at what they are doing to the motorist[img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img][img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]

WE NEED THIS KIND OF THINGUk Version of the Tuff Tuff Club





Huxley
Old 09 May 2003, 04:49 PM
  #18  
Huxley
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This makes some intresting reading!

Link with graphs here

An analysis of the overall traffic and accident situation in each of 16 European countries carried out by the European Road Assessment Programme (EuroRAP), shows that the UK has the safest roads in Europe.



Road fatalities per 100,000 population
Portugal 21
Greece 20.2
Spain 14.6
France 14.4
Belgium 13.7
Luxembourg 13.5
Austria 13.4
Italy 11
Ireland 11
Denmark 9.7
Germany 9.5
Netherlands 6.9
Sweden 6.6
United Kingdom 5.9


This difference is even better when we look at motorways only.



Motorways — Deaths per billion vehicle-km.
Portugal 14.1
Italy 12.8
Austria 8.9
Belgium 7.2
France 5.4
Finland 5.0
Germany 4.5
Denmark 4.3
Ireland 4.0
Switzerland 3.3
Netherlands 3.3
Sweden 3.2
United Kingdom 2.0


Compare this with motorway usage. Due to lack of government investment in sufficient motorway routes, the UK's motorways are significantly busier than other european motorways. Despite this our motorways are still by far the safest.



Motorway usage
(Average daily vehicle flow)
United Kingdom 64,900
Netherlands 52,400
Germany 45,800
Belgium 44,600
Switzerland 38,200
France 29,400
Denmark 26,700
Italy 26,000
Ireland 26,000
Austria 25,600
Portugal 25,100
Sweden 17,700


Our motorway safety is clearly excellent compared with other countries, and our relative A-road safety is equally good.



A-class roads — deaths per billion vehicle-km
(Those roads that are immediately below motorway standard — Not all countries supply this data.)
Austria 22.9
France 20.6
Belgium 19.9
Germany 19.5
Netherlands 17.5
Denmark 15.5
Ireland 14.0
Finland 12.2
United Kingdom 6.2


Once again this excellent road safety record exists despite our A roads being busier than other European countries due to the UK's lack of investment in new roads and bypasses.



A-class roads usage
(Average daily vehicle flow)
United Kingdom 17,200
France 10,100
Germany 9,500
Netherlands 8,100
Belgium 7,400
Finland 3,200



When the UK clearly has by far the safest roads in Europe, we have to ask why we also have the most anti-car government in Europe, if not the world.

The British government spends millions of pounds of public money on propaganda which gives the impression that our roads are the worst in Europe.

To implement it's so called "road safety" policy, it imposes speed cameras, traffic calming, speed humps, unreasonably low speed limits, bus lanes, road narrowing, and complete road closures. It covers our roads and pavements with a shambolic mess of white lines, red and green splodges, textured surfaces and obstructions.

Despite our motorways being the safest in Europe by a country mile, the government pig-headedly refuses to raise the utterly discredited 70 mph motorway speed limit.

We are not saying that road safety in the UK cannot be improved, but the way to achieve that is clearly to praise drivers for being the safest in Europe, and to encourage excellence through education. Battering drivers with an endless succession of 'sticks' may be something favoured by the likes of John Prescott, but people do not take kindly to such aggression and abuse of power.

Source: www.eurorap.org. Based on the most recent 3 years worth of data up to 2000.


The *******[img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]


Huxley
Old 09 May 2003, 05:44 PM
  #19  
Gooner
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Red face

Sadly this will all drive people to break the law in a number of ways,

I have been told of 3 people who had false plates made for their vehicles, these are only 1 digit different from the originals, and when stopped will claim, OH HECK, I had these made up as they were stolen, broken, etc and never noticed, this method won't become extinct because of the new laws for manufacturing them, as I am sure there will be a black economy for this product. Where can I get some?

Many vehicles are not registered, insured, taxed, MOT,d, the driver has no licence, probably pissed or high on something, bald tyres, dodgy haircut! etc, etc, etc. If they actually get stopped by a Police Officer they will get 20 hours community service and a nice break in the sun! If they get caught on a camera they cannot be traced!
Old 09 May 2003, 06:35 PM
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Poor Guy
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Angry

if I ever get caught by a gatso ill borrow a land rover and a long chain and pull the ****er down!
Old 09 May 2003, 07:29 PM
  #21  
robby
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Angry

i heard on the news this week West Yorkshire (yep i'm from there :-( ) is to have the number of cameras doubled within the next 2 years!!!!!!
Old 09 May 2003, 09:09 PM
  #22  
greg.g
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Angry


I have no objection to having cameras outside schools and
genuine accident black spots. In these locations lives may indeed
be saved. But that is not where they tend to be. You see them
on dual carraigways,urban clearways,country roads.In short,low
risk areas[img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img][img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img][img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img] These are the roads where one might be
inclined to stray a little over the legal speed limit if conditions allow. Revenue raising areas[img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]
Now like alot of people, i like the occasional blast on a country
road. If i do this in good weather conditions and at a quiet
time of day, then the only one i am endangering is myself
I have got a clean licence-no points, but with cameras popping
up everywhere for how much longer
I have bought myself a speed camera detector to give me an edge.
I know that i should not speed.
But at the end of the day, my car is a damned site safer than
the cars of 30 years ago with drum brakes all round weighing 2 tons
on cross-ply tyres when the speed limits were set.
Sorry about the moan[img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img][img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]

Greg
Old 09 May 2003, 11:13 PM
  #23  
boomer
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Angry

They are even getting greedy in Cumbria

See http://www.thisisthelakedistrict.co....ml?nwid=720215

Motorists react to speed cameras

By Ellis Butcher

MOTORISTS are already adapting to a serious police effort to cut road deaths at accident blackspots in Cumbria by warning other drivers that mobile speed cameras are in operation, reports Ellis Butcher.

Police getting to grips with the new roadside technology in Furness and South Lakeland have spotted drivers flashing their lights to warn oncoming motorists to watch their speed.

"I have had feedback from some bobbies to say that it has been like a Pink Floyd light show out there," said Kevin Tea, a spokesman for the project.

In another scheme launched this week, Cumbria Police and the DVLA are joining forces to tackle the county's estimated 19,000 untaxed cars by taking to the streets in the DVLA's Stingray mobile camera units accompanied by wheel clamping teams.

The cameras can read the number plates of passing vehicles and check them against DVLA records and then store the images of unlicensed cars. Fines can go up to £1,000 for cars and £23,000 for HGVs.

The safety camera scheme will monitor 20 sites throughout the area with speed checks being carried out at each site twice a month.

Annually, 3,300 people are fined for speeding in Cumbria and a further 20,200 fines will need to be issued if the £1.3 million scheme is to pay for itself in the first year.

Offending motorists will be fined £60 in a notice through the post in which they must return their driving licence for endorsement.

People can request a court appearance, while those that refuse to pay or have been pictured doing excessive speed, will be summonsed to court.

The aim is to cut deaths and serious accidents on roads in Cumbria by 15 per cent between now and 2006, with fatalities/serious injury accidents falling by 27 in the first year.

The cameras will be operated from specially painted police bays and will target 47 sites in the county, which account for 76 per cent of all serious accidents.

The scheme is run by the Cumbria Road Casualty Reduction Partnership, which includes the police, Cumbria County Council and Cumbria Magistrates' Court.

It hopes that decreasing serious accidents will help relieve the burden on the health service.

Sanctioned by the Department for Transport, the partnership has purchased six new mobile cameras that can be mounted on tripods or vans.

Motorists are given advanced warnings of where checks are taking place by roadside signs placed a kilometre away and the cameras are operated by officers wearing high visibility clothing. The money generated from fines can be claimed back from the Government but only to cover costs and to carry out further speed enforcement.

Steve Callaghan, Safety Camera project manager, said: "We are trying to change people's opinions. The police are not going to get any money out of this and we will not be hiding behind trees. The only people that will pay are those breaking the statutory speed limits. It is more important to get to where you are going safely, than it is to get there on time."

Mobile cameras will be operated on the A6 at Shap Road and Milnthorpe Road, Kendal; the A685 Appleby Road, Kendal, the A65 Hollin Hall to Hornsbarrow, Kirkby Lonsdale; Burton Road and Lound Road, and Lound Road to Oxenholme Road, Kendal.

On the A590 sites monitored will be between Heaves, Levens and Gilpin, Haverthwaite to Backbarrow, the Bouth Road Junction to Greenodd, and Newlands, Ulverston.

The A591 coverage will be Ings and Ings Village, the A592 on Rayrigg Road, Bowness, the A5087 coast road and the B5277 Lindale Road, Grange.

A6 sites include the A6 Selside, taking in Forest Hall, Selside, and Garnett Bridge, and on the M6, Junction 37 to 38 and Junction 38 to 39.

14:22 Thursday 17th April 2003
Old 10 May 2003, 01:01 AM
  #24  
Adrian F
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The thing is that the current policy has lost all credability if you relaise that last year 2 million people were convicted of speeding and yest there was approx 200-250 people killed by exceeding the speed limit. Now as sad as any road death is nearly 2 million people were proved to have broken the speed limit (and many more did but were not caught) and did not crash by doing this so therefore it is obvioulsy proved by the governments own policy to be 99%+ safe to exceed the posted speed limit!!!

In anybody opinon this is a very good risk probaly better than that of doing DIY against serious injury.



Old 05 August 2003, 09:04 AM
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[Edited by bros2 - 7/2/2003 4:51:35 PM]
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