RAJ27

I filled up today and it was 87.9p!! It was only 79.9p a few weeks ago....... We need another blockades lads!

ProperCharlie

Apparently crude oil at $105 a barrel (compared to $55 at present) would result in a pump price of just over £1.00 a litre, which just goes to show what a small amount of the cost of petrol is the raw material cost. IMO £1.00 a litre would be tolerable in any case. It's still less than £5.00 a gallon.

carl

Can't be too far off. I filled up with Optimax at 90.9p a litre the other day...

jameswrx

iTrader: (4)

sheesh, you must get it cheap!

Normal unleaded was 93.9 in a station near me.

boxst

Hello

What happened recently? I too noticed that it suddenly jumped from 79.x to 86.x in the last week or so.

Steve.

ProperCharlie

The price of crude hit $55 (big deal, I know ), and there were various scare stories about prices reaching $100+, the chinese and indians nicking all the oil etc, which was enough to get our generous retailers to whack on a few pence a litre.

gareth123

It's jumped to US$2.62/gallon for me in the last few months. It was below $2 for a while. That's a pretty big % jump there!

If we stopped exporting all our manufacturing, technology and service jobs to India and China they wouldn't be able to afford so much oil. We're slowly killing ourselves for cheap call centres and cheaper plastic crap

Vegescoob

Sorry, the point is that "they" can do all that we do, as well, if not better in the technology and manufacturing arenas.
"They" will also get even better, their populations are eager for education, unlike much of ours and are prepared to work to achieve.
We, in the West are now on a downward path.
We are now a post industrial society, many claim. What does that mean?
Look around you and look at what the Asian economies are planning for their infrastructure.
Fastest train in the world is in China.

imlach

Do you see the irony though. People in the West want to pay less & less for their consumables (electrical goods, general hardware, food, etc etc), and want their money to go further in banking,insurance, etc.....

Guess who can provide a lot of these goods & services at cheaper prices than the West can.....

People want cheaper car insurance, so all the UK companies look at how they can lower their costs versus the competition - hence outsourcing to India etc...

Yes, there are still a minority who would choose a UK based product/service over a foreign one, even if it cost more, but the majority will vote with their wallets....

You see it on here all the time. Rip off this, rip off that, car insurance too high, etc etc.....fine, but so long as they realise that ultimately, this is driving our UK businesses offshore.

Vegescoob

Why do you think our politicians want to "sort out" Africa.
Simple, because that will be the next source of cheap labour once the Asian economies become "mature".

AntiPastor

gareth123

Nope. They are cheaper, that is all. I work with a lot of Third World techies and, as a rule, they are not as good. But they cost 80% less. Indian call centres are better?!

Our shortsightedness and greed is killing us. The West is slowly tranfering its wealth over to Asia. This is going to bite us in the **** IMO.

imlach

They are certainly not as efficient. They tend to throw endless bodies at projects just to get them completed on time (not a great plan as any project manager will know!).

However, over time, as they get more experienced, and some Westerners move over there to help out, they will get better. We're all humans with the same size of brains. There's no reason they can't match/better us over time. They just need the experience, and by golly, they're learning fast!


It will, yes. As far as I can see, the best profession to get into now is probably healthcare - after all, unemployed couch potatoes need a lot of medical support. You can't really outsource medical care!!

gareth123

I've gone out of my way and spent more $$$ to avoid buying stuff made in China, and I'll continue to do so. I wish more people would do the same

gareth123

In my experience they are certainly not as creative. They are often *better* at math and (programming) syntax and theory but they just can't apply it. Maybe it's cultural and going against the herd is frowned up on? Dunno. You can't give them a raw problem and expect a decent solution. You *can* give them a detailed specification on how to code the solution and get reasonable code back, though. And they are cheap. Really, really cheap.

Vegescoob

This is the history of the World.
Years ago, my Latin master told us that "civilisation" moved from East to West. The West once dominant is now facing the fact that the East is now in the ascendant.
For "civilisation" I now substitute industrialisation and I see that he was correct.
Your experience may be more valid than mine but be in no doubt your Third World techies will improve and fast.
In my lifetime I have seen the quality of manufactures from the Asian countries improve beyand compare.
I can remember how the Japanese motorcycle industry killed the British one because the British industry thought it could continue selling ancient designs of poor quality.
Believe me, our politicians and elite are worried and that is why they are seeking to put into place more and more forms of social control.

imlach

...and cheap is music to a project managers ears

In my previous experience of outsourcing, we've tended to (ab)use their services for the tedious & menial coding tasks to allow our chaps to get on with the wizzy stuff.

IIRC, we were talking $25k for about 3-4 man years effort!! That'd be $400k easily in UK based resource.

Vegescoob

Ffs, our universities are closing maths, science and engineering departments.
Great for the future?

Lum

Because, hey! China has an opressive controlling reigeme and they're doing pretty well, it must be because of that, so we'll copy it and not worry about any of the other problems!

Vegescoob

Your guess as to how long before they are doing the wizzy stuff?

gareth123

I'm not surprised. I have Comp Sci degree but there is no way I'd encourage a Western teenager to take a math/science/engineering course today. I'd tell them to be a dentist or similar.

And the 'elite' don't give a carp. As long as their massive holdings in GE and IBM and GM and Nokia keep churning out fat dividends what do they care where the labour producing the product is? The drive behind much of this outsourcing is 'increasing shareholder value' - i.e. screwing the working sap to give even more to the rich.

Vegescoob

No, because if you read stuff about China you will find that those in charge are aware they will have to loosen the strings and are doing it slowly.
Of course the population as it becomes more educated and has more contact with the West might want faster reform, which could spell trouble.
As regards our "leaders" they are fearful of a complete breakdown in the social order. We see some areas showing this now. Look at the threads here on SN where many of us complain about criminality. Voter apathy, distate for politicians are examples of this breakdown.

gareth123

Shut up or we'll take you to political prison on the WORLD'S FASTEST TRAIN!

Lum

Dude, it's called sarcasm

Vegescoob

You might be misunderstanding me. I'm not saying whether I approve or not.I'm saying it how it is.
Yes the elite will pursue profits. Was ever thus.
If you want to stop this it would mean a return to protectionism.
My problem is that I would like to see a fairer world but loooking at the history of the majority of forms of social organisation, most end up with an elite living off the rest.

Vegescoob

Yes, but still a good late night thread.
Sort I like, getting others' views and thoughts about big issues.

gareth123

I quite like the status quo as is, and I don't like the idea of my standard of living going down so China's can go up. And that is what is happening at the moment.

Taking a macro view on this global realignment is all well and dandy, but it doesn't help the poor schmuck who needs to feed his family but his job just got 'offshored' to add a few points on the stock price. I should add that this hasn't happened to me but I've been living and working in Silicon Valley through a period where 20% of the jobs have gone, and it ain't pretty. I don't give a hoot that Bangalore is booming, that is not my society.

Vegescoob

I see your point but the problem is we are all caught up in this through our own savings, investments, pension funds etc. and if we want good returns the fund managers will follow the current path.
"May you live in interesting times". We do don't we.

wez_sti

not long i imagine, as i paid 97.9 the other day!