LG John

Heads up - some of this info is second hand:

My lass (Laura) is a Dog Warden with the Local Authority and earns around £14,000 a year (about the same as a basic, basic admin job). Today she has had a call from the Police who have seized an aggressive dog that has been used in recent weeks as a fighting dog. I don’t know its breed but its fair to assume it’s a fighting breed. Apparently the Police have some sort of paperwork that expires at the end of the day and want to destroy the dog by shooting it. They request that Laura goes to the station to restrain the dog whilst the copper blows it nuts off. Laura is reluctant and scared for a number of reasons and is being pressured by her own line manager to go along and help.

As far as I’m aware ‘assisting in dangerous dog destruction’ is not in her job title!! She has not been given training on how to handle aggressive/dangerous dogs or training on the little equipment she has been provided with. She does not have the full monty bite suits, neck/face guards, etc and even if she did she’s never been trained to use then or handle such a situation. We both feel it is absolutely an unacceptable risk for her to be exposed to without the proper equipment and training.

I’m as un-P.C. and un-health & safety as they get, but I draw the line here. This is likely to be a powerful and aggressive dog that has been mis-treated (trust issues) by humans for weeks (or more) and forced to fight other animals. I do not think Laura should be tackling it without training and equipment to do that job and certainly not on 14k a year which, IMHO, in no way reflects the level of risk to undertake this sort of task!!

Are we being unreasonable? Is she within her rights to dig her heels in and refuse to do the job on ‘safety’ grounds?

davegtt

Tell them to fek off. No way should she have to be doing that, in fact even if she was trained I still dont think she should have to go and even watch whilst they actually shoot the dog. Certainly not something I would expect from them anyway.

Nigel H

Has someone done a risk assessment? Sounds like they should have, if so ask to see it.

I'm with you BTW

Holyterror72

You need to have given your employees sufficent training to undertake anything. They should have risk assessments or at least a method statement as to how this should be done safely.

Surely they have a standard procedure for undertaking this process as it cant be a one off.

SiPie

That sentence could be re-jumbled into an interesting day for the copper



PS I'd be shooting the dangerous dog from a safe distance, surely a vet should be called to tranquilise the thing in the first place. It can't be her job to do that !!!

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

The risk assessment thing is paramount. No risk assessment = no job done, especially on those grounds.

And you can see the RA and argue it if you need to.

Why the fek can't the police dart it, then shoot the damned thing or have it injected by a veterinarian?

Alcazar

bugeyeandy

It's irrelevant how much she earns or if she's been trained, police have dog handlers and they should use their own handlers for the job.
Not worth the risk IMO.

LG John

She's not been asked to do anything like this before so no idea about 'risk assessments', etc. Doubtful they exist! Her council is a joke! Apparantly every Council is supposed to have an "Animal Health & Welfare Officer" (the job laura wants) but her Council haven't bothered and just get the trading standards guys to sign off paperwork relating to that roll even though they have no idea about animal welfare, etc. In other words they turn up to inspect the local zoo think it looks fine and say, 'nae bothers'! J.O.K.E!!!

Wurzel

iTrader: (1)

I assumed a vet would put a dog down not a copper shooting it. You certainly wouldn't have a civilian holding the dog whilst a copper shot it that is just feckin ridiculous.

LG John

"They request that Laura goes to the station to restrain the dog whilst the copper blows it nuts off."

Copper at the station restrains Laura like a dog and blows his nuts off

LG John

Wurzel that's my thoughts too. I'm surprised a vet isn't being called to do this. That said, I'm sure that the cops have powers to instantly destroy a dog if they perceive public risk (don't quote me).

The cops should have trained handlers though that have been in the suits with two beefy dogs trying to rip their face off. In other words they know what they are doing so surely they should be attending this!

Jerome

Soldiers can't go for a run these days without a risk assessment being done.

I've spent some time around trained guard dogs and they needed specialist training to be able to handle them, let alone a dog trained for fighting.

If, due to management pressure, she feels her job would be at risk if she didn't go, she should get it in writing that the manager wants her to go without the necessary risk assessments and training being performed.

Shooting even a restrained dog is an incredibly risky task. I can't believe there isn't a vet or specialist with wild animals that has a tranquiliser gun within a reasonable distance.

al4x1

Ok Tell her in no way to do it. Its ludicrous I've seen trigger happy cops before wanting to shoot things as my dads a vet. You've a couple of issues firstly the dog and ok she will be trained to handle normal dogs but not pit bulls, and certainly its not something you want to do to try and hold it still enough so the "trained marksman" doesn't miss.
The second issue is where is this going to be done, bullets ricochet off tarmac and concrete so personally I'd want to be nowhere down range of the dog. To me the only way to deal with it is to feed it a good number of ACP (animal tranquilizers) tablets and get a vet to put it down when its tranquilized.

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Wait till she is 'on', she will do it for free with a biro having bollocked it for breathing if shes anything like my missus.

Anyway, could a vet be called out to tranquilise it with a dart gun and then off it ?

Jay m A

iTrader: (2)

How about let it fight another dog, if it loses then no bother, if it wins then it will be tired and easier to restrain

LG John

Update

Right, I've got the full story now as I talked to Laura on the way home. I am soooooooooo f*cking angry!!!

The facts are:

* Laura was phoned by the police and asked to attend a house to enter and restrain a dog.
* The dog is unattended in the home because its owner is in jail.
* The owner is in jail - you're not going to believe this - because he trained his dog to attack people and set it on someone!!
* That 'someone' is currently in hospital with severe bite injuries!

The police expected Laura to go into the house as the first point of contact with this animal - who's most recent encounter with a human was in attack mode - to approach the animal, restrain it, get it in her van and take it to a vets for destruction.

(lol at how far away from the original story this is)

Anyway, having said she wasn't prepared to do it the police phoned her line manager who then contacted Laura and tried to pressure her into doing it.

Laura pointed out that:

* She wasn't aware that this form of restraint was in her job description
* She regarded this as a highly dangerous animal
* She does not have a bite suit with head and face protection
* She has not had any form of training to deal with this sort of a situation (i.e. a dog that might try and rip her face off)

His counter arguments were:

* It's part of her job!
* She has a arm bite protector (so that'll do her a lot of good if it rips her neck open!!)
* There is a bite suit 'somewhere' but he doesn't know where it's kept

He ended the conversation basically by threatening to look into her job description because he felt she wasn't undertaking her duties.

I cannot stress how angry I am!!!! What an utterly irresponsible attitude he has taken putting an untrained individual into what could be a very dangerous situation. I'm sure that 99.9% of the time she'd walk in, pat the dog, put a lead on it, walk it to the van, job done. It's that 1:1000th time that it mauls her that doesn't sit too pretty with me!!!! Not only that, she's a bloody women- not that a man would do much better if the dog attacked - and she certainly doesn't have the natural strength to restrain a powerful dog.

Am I the only one that finds this situation quite unacceptable?

DCI Gene Hunt

The police have done nothing wrong, they've contacted what they understand to be a dog handler

The line manager is attempting to pressure Laura into the task

First good idea, a meeting to run through the risk assessment, confirm the level of training required, what protective equipment is needed and what method is to be used to secure animals like this in the future...

Its a feckin joke, but needs to be played formally and not in a hot headed way.....

LG John

Agree completely. This is my style. Explode in the comfort of my own home then tear them appart with a letter/appropriate action, etc.

DCI Gene Hunt

And don't forget that HSE helpline, and tell her manager that maybe you should contact them for 'clarification'..... watch him turn grey at that point

Holy Ghost

i'm with SiPie & the DCI: vet in protective gear tranks the dog with a dart; administers lethal injection when dog is out cold. that, or something approaching it, has got to be the SOP in a case like this.

i hope your g/f dumps the stupid plod up to his neck in paperwork and a disciplinary for unreasonable behaviour and a blatant breach of HSE.

where can you get a bite suit from? i need one to protect me from mrs ghost.

kittle

not reading all of it but the dog should be sedated therefore not needing any control from a human. putting anyone in a dangerous situation with no need is a joke! and that def falls short of health and safety!

Sosbanite

Am I the only one that finds this situation quite unacceptable?

Not at all

The situation is totally mismanaged by the police and council and has not had an ounce of common sense applied to it yet alone risk assessed!!!!!!!

Kick in the front door and try to shoot the ******* thing as it runs at your missus? If ever a plan was going to go wrong..........

as has been said, get a vet to dart it or poison some food, it will get hungry eventually, FFS!

Your good lady should seek legal advice should her manager get ****ty, they wont have a leg to stand on!

Good luck with sorting it all out.

mart360

Funny how no one has mentioned the easiest solution...



marksmen? there meant to be the elite....

they batter the door down, one takes the dog full frontal,,,,and the rest pop caps in its ***, if there as good as they say, it should be done deal in about... 3 mins

why bother with all this restraint crap

seriously though

the dog is in a nice big cage.... leave the fcking thing there... in three weeks it will have done the deed by its self...


Prehaps the powers that be should have some new rulings.... any dangerous / high risk animal encounters, should be attended by the loonies who think that satan the face ripper,, should be put on a lead, fed a warm bowl of peddigree chum, before be mildly anethatised(sp) for the final journey.. once a few of them have suffered a few maulings, they'll adopt the right idea on how to deal with these type of dogs..

Mart

paulr

She's a dog handler but doesn't want to handle a dog. So what exactly do dog handlers do?

SiDHEaD

You obviously skim-read and missed the not trained bit in your haste for a witty comment

TopBanana

Definitely recommend this route. Some prat at worked phoned them cos he wouldn't move a few boxes, and it ended up getting all legal. If the HSE kick off over something so minor they'd have a field day with this case.

paulr

It was a sensible question. What do dog handlers do?
Obviously that passed you by in your haste to post an insult.

Iwan

Would they lend her one of those bomb disposal suits, or better yet one of these?



Actually screw that.



+

Fuzz

I'm with Paul R.
Police get reports of a unruly dog locked up in a house alone.
Thinks to self.. who should they call.
Yup, the dog handler.

Sounds like your missus needs a bit more training to fulfil her role if she wants to become a dog handler, after all that's what they do..

I am a little perplexed as to why the police want to get gung ho on it's *** with some lead caps mind.
That's sounds like the vets job.

It should be a team effort of all three parties and all three need to be trained up in the department they specialise in.
Police to effect a break in,
Dog handler/s to catch the thing,
Vet to send it to sleep.

I think you are right.. or your missus is right in turning down the suggestion she should be part of this without proper training.

The only person I see at fault is the line manager, having not trained her to do her job fully.


Andy

fast bloke

Dog warden job interview
Interviewer - What would you do in the event that you were asked to control a big dog.
Interviewee - I would ask for a H&S assesment of the situation and then refuse to attend as I haven't been geiven specific on the dog training.

What do you reckon the career prospects are for this interviewee?