JonMc

iTrader: (51)

Just a though and something I have discussed in the past with friends and colleagues, should we bring back national service.

Would a 2-3 year dose of discipline and a stint at the front line sort out this winging, whining, overly sensative and politically correct, and generally lazy generation of people that we seem to be breeding, or would national service breed more contempt from these people and make them feel that now that they have done their bit for Queen and Country that they now have more right to leech off society?

I'm in the services anyway so it wouldn't bother me, but it would be interesting to hear the views of those who haven't and don't intend to serve for whatever reason. I know it's just not for some people.

Fuzz

Everyone..

Can't see the point in sending just the leeches of society. Everyone needs a crack of the whip.


Andy

slagmagnet69

Not everyone but certainly all the chav's living near me - think it could only be a good thing both for them and society in general.

Leslie

It was for everyone in the first place although you could get it delayed for a good reason such as a university course.

It did do a lot of good to anyone who did it in that it taught respect and discipline and also how to look after yourself in life. You would learn a trade of some kind which could be valuable in later life and you also learned to take a pride in what you were doing. You also learned to work as a team instead of against each other which would be a much better situation in this world today. Any success you achieved was based on personal merit. That cannot be said to be a bad thing.

Since it applied to all who were physically fit, no one lost out by doing it.

Les

Chip

Leslie.
You just about summed it up there

Chip

ScoobyDoo555

yes - everybody. Moreso those who are leeches though...

555Rob555

The Bundeswehr (German army) operate a national service policy.
If by the time you have left school, you have not started an apprentiship or college, you can choose between the Army, or working in public services (Hospitals, old age homes etc).

This makes people get off their idle backsides and do something.

You also have to paid taxes for a minimum of 1 year before you are entitled to welfare.

Sounds like a good idea to me.

Petem95

Zero chance of it happening! Can you imagine all the muslim immigrants doing that? They are totally against most of this country's principles and would no way do national service!

No doubt it would violate human rights too (ie if someone didnt want to do it, you couldnt make them)

slagmagnet69

Can we start a petetion?

Sonic'

I dont think the government MP's would be any good doing National Service

Seriously though, as Leslie has pointed out regarding the benefits of doing national service, maybe we should send them when they are 5 years old, and not 16 or 18

The kids of today need to learn discipline, respect etc once they start school, this is I believe where a lot of problems lie, as they are no longer taught it at school

By the time they are 16 it is generally too late for a lot of kids,

moses

they should be put in factories and make nice things that will benefit the country and sell it tae other states

B9GLY

would be no good imo and would not solve the lazy, chav scummers in this country. however, bringing back the cane in schools would as thats where the problems lie imo, high school is where all the social problems come from the lack of respect and discipline!

moses

true aboot the cane and also separation of lassie and lads schools will go a long way and they will concentrate mair on education than ***** or d1ck

Felix.

I think if you are between 16 and 21 and are not in either a full time employment or in full time education you should be forced to go. If you don't go - you get no benefits. I can't see how this would go aginst human rights.

I often ask myself - if we had to go to war now (as in world war 1 or 2 again) what chance would we have with the current calibre of our youth...???

warrenm2

no, I dont think so. Its a tax on your time by the Government, time you could spend more productively elsewhere.

As for the lazy slackers, just incentivise them through rejigging the benefit and tax system, no need for forced militarization

Prasius

iTrader: (1)

Jon - would you honestly want to have to take these people through basic training as it stands now in any of the three services?

15 - 20 years ago it may of worked; simply because the section Corporal could take the idiotic, lazy wastes of space in his section around the back of the block and kick seven kinds of crap out of them until they had learnt their lesson. Now, individuals are expected to have a bit of self-motivation.

I just don't see how you could train the people with the rules we have to abide by now.

fast bloke

I think Felix has the answer. Add to that, if you can't make a stab of controlling your own life you loose all the human rights bullsh1t that stops the lazy and workshy from being kicked and beaten into shape. The basic message should be "contribute to society or we will kick the **** out of you until you work out how to contribute to society"

JonMc

iTrader: (51)

I agree that in today's forces it's not the same as when I joined almost 15 years ago, when being shouted at didn't constitute bullying. In theory the idea is great, and maybe if we hadn't stopped national service in the fifties we wouldn't be in the state we are in now

chocolate_o_brian

iTrader: (22)

i personally think its a bad idea. for the chavs, leeches etc, its a great idea, all the benifit scammers etc, yes also. but for folk like me, id never ever want to be in the services, whether it be the army, r.a.f., etc. i have my reasons, but im not going to disclose them on here. i just think its a bad idea.

andy

Jerome

I would be all for it but, if it was brought in, there would have to be a non-military option.

Some people are simply not suited to any form of military life, let alone handling weapons etc.

DCI Gene Hunt

Well it would say a **** load on having to buy weapons, as most teenagers could now take their own guns with them

Scoob99

iTrader: (1)

Yes i think it is a good Idea Leslie hit the nail right on the head, plus it would sort the scum who think standing on street corners shouting abuse at people getting pissed up and starting fights for no good reason, in one way it couls put this country back on track to being Great Britain again!!!!!
Cheers
Colin

CrisPDuk

You need to look at it from the other side for a moment. Imagine you are one of those who signed up and are proud to be members of the world's most professional (if under manned and under funded) armed forces, would you really want them admitting a bunch of useless, freeloading fcukwits which you'd then probably be expected to train

mr_p1ssed_off

philc

couple of views -

guys I've talked to who were conscripts in the fifties reckon it was a complete waste of time - all blanco and bullsh##.

and a view from the top - in Colin Powell's autobiography he reckons having a conscript army was incredibly difficult to motivate and train ....

Having said that, taking an idea from the middle east, forming the First Chav Suicide Squadron who head across the desert towards enemy lines in souped up, explosive-packed Vauxhall Viva's has a certain appeal

SJ_Skyline

I think we would have a pretty good chance. I've seen them fighting each other outside pubs at 1 o'clock in the morning.

CrisPDuk

Kind of like 'Operation get behind the Darkies' in South Park - The Movie

I think even the army regulars would go for that one

David Lock

Interesting in that quite a few posters blamed the education sysem but not a mention of where problems start which is in the home. You can't be **** parents and then expect the school to turn your kid around. It's too late by then.

I like the German idea of doing some compulsory community work as an alternative to military service. I am not too sure I would want my son being sent out to a questionable war Iraq for example. dl

SJ_Skyline

A case of nail & head. I've got to agree with your last point, I would not want any child of mine involved in Iraq in this way.

The Zohan

Very True, problems often start at home with poor parenting, schools are powerless to do much in the way of change or discipline or even educate some kids who chose not to learn and/or skive off with no way of enforcing the rules. The law favours kids as do the PC idiots in charge. Modern kids have too much influence and control.

As for your second point.
This really is a whole can of worns

I agree with SJ as i would not want my kids involved due to the illegality (in my mind).
However, the armed forces loyalties are to King/Queen and Country, and this may lie in direct conflict with some peoples religious beliefs. I am not sure how this would work.

Good parenting (by rich and poor alike) plus decent strict schooling and respect for laws/rules and the people whio enforce them used to install disciple and a value system in kids who then grew up to become parents and pass this on. Class or where you live or how much you earn should not be the issues and a barrier or an excuse for poor parenting and antisocial behaviour.

Good from bad, right from wrong are basics as is respect for others.


I do not soley blame NL as the seeds where sown a long time back. Someone does need to sort out the mess and i am pretty sure Blair and Brown are just not up to it, they have singularly failed to do so in the last 10 years!