now ferrari are realy in it
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now ferrari are realy in it
bye bye jean todt
BBC SPORT | Motorsport | Formula One | Todt steps down as Ferrari boss
are ferrari on there way down as a top team?
BBC SPORT | Motorsport | Formula One | Todt steps down as Ferrari boss
are ferrari on there way down as a top team?
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I know, I was thinking that, it does seem a bit strange, in fact didnt Todt announce this news at the end of last years season ?
Maybe the BBC want to find some blame for Ferrari's poor performance on the opening race
Maybe the BBC want to find some blame for Ferrari's poor performance on the opening race
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Originally Posted by sonic'
Maybe the BBC want to find some blame for Ferrari's poor performance on the opening race
its mclarens fault they had poor performance, excuses started already
Ferrari suspects ECU to blame for Aus woes - Yahoo! Eurosport UK
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Their engines are mediocre and over hyped, now they are stuffed without the genius of Todt and Brawn at the helm.
Go Mclaren, good to hear the National Anthem at the end of the last race.
Go Mclaren, good to hear the National Anthem at the end of the last race.
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Team boss Stefano Domenicali, meanwhile, also suggested that Ferrari's Albert Park dramas could be related to the new ECU, which is developed jointly by Woking based McLaren Electronic Systems and Microsoft, and awarded the tender to equip all F1 cars until 2010 by the FIA.
#12
I hardly think that Ferrari can be criticised for their engineering and F1 ability after their record over the years. They have now lost their two star organisers in Ross Brawn and Jean Todt which is a bit of a difficult situation to cope with and we do not know Felisa's capabilities yet.
Yes they had a hard time at Melbourne, not all the fault of the drivers, but it is far too early to start saying that they are a spent force.
As much as I support Hamilton and McClaren to win, I would never underestimate Ferrari's chances.
Les
Yes they had a hard time at Melbourne, not all the fault of the drivers, but it is far too early to start saying that they are a spent force.
As much as I support Hamilton and McClaren to win, I would never underestimate Ferrari's chances.
Les
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Ross Brawn wasn't there last year, yet Kimi won the World Championship.
Ferrari will come back strong. The loss of Todt won't have that much an affect on this years championship.
McLaren do have an unfair advantage in my view with the standard ECU's.
Ferrari will come back strong. The loss of Todt won't have that much an affect on this years championship.
McLaren do have an unfair advantage in my view with the standard ECU's.
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how can something that gives everyone the same thing make it unfair? pmsl
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Wrong. The ECU's are written by a company owned by McLaren. It was developed in conjunction with McLaren F1 cars/Mercedes engines.
All other teams have to write software to be compatible with the ECU for their own car/Engine package.
So. McLaren have an advantage as in the ECU was developed to suit their car. Ferrari, BMW, Toyota etc have to write software to suit.
Prodrive have a standard ECU map for PPP. Doesn't mean every WRX/STI fitted with it will perform the same does it?
Imagine if the FIA had said Ferrari are to develop a standard ECU for all cars. McLaren would be the first to protest.
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I agree though that "they could" have a slight advantage even though it is a brand new ecu for all teams Obvously the company that designed it is owned by Mclaren so specs will have obviouslt filtered through, and the chances are mclaren had a pre production model running way before any of the other teams.
I think though that if it was going to cause problems then it would do so for the teams with smaller budgets and certainly not ferrari.
I think other teams have had the ecus since december? so why only start complaining now when pre season went well ?
they are just looking for scapegoats again as they cannot take critiscm after a bad performance.. They just need to stop moaning and take it on the chin, people will respect them more
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Wrong. The ECU's are written by a company owned by McLaren. It was developed in conjunction with McLaren F1 cars/Mercedes engines.
All other teams have to write software to be compatible with the ECU for their own car/Engine package.
So. McLaren have an advantage as in the ECU was developed to suit their car. Ferrari, BMW, Toyota etc have to write software to suit.
Prodrive have a standard ECU map for PPP. Doesn't mean every WRX/STI fitted with it will perform the same does it?
Imagine if the FIA had said Ferrari are to develop a standard ECU for all cars. McLaren would be the first to protest.
All other teams have to write software to be compatible with the ECU for their own car/Engine package.
So. McLaren have an advantage as in the ECU was developed to suit their car. Ferrari, BMW, Toyota etc have to write software to suit.
Prodrive have a standard ECU map for PPP. Doesn't mean every WRX/STI fitted with it will perform the same does it?
Imagine if the FIA had said Ferrari are to develop a standard ECU for all cars. McLaren would be the first to protest.
There is no way on this earth that the "standard" ecu would confer any anvantage on McLaren. If there was the slightest belief it would, the other teams, Ferrari included, would have veto'd the deal.
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And another thing - these teams have millions of dollars to spend on R&D - if they don't have an intimate knowledge of what exactly that standard ECU is all about through detailed testing and analysis, then they have no one but themselves to blame.
Unless of course Ron has somehow engineered a "**** you" line of code in there somewhere that only he can activate by remote control....
Unless of course Ron has somehow engineered a "**** you" line of code in there somewhere that only he can activate by remote control....
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Wrong. The ECU's are written by a company owned by McLaren. It was developed in conjunction with McLaren F1 cars/Mercedes engines.
All other teams have to write software to be compatible with the ECU for their own car/Engine package.
So. McLaren have an advantage as in the ECU was developed to suit their car. Ferrari, BMW, Toyota etc have to write software to suit.
Prodrive have a standard ECU map for PPP. Doesn't mean every WRX/STI fitted with it will perform the same does it?
Imagine if the FIA had said Ferrari are to develop a standard ECU for all cars. McLaren would be the first to protest.
All other teams have to write software to be compatible with the ECU for their own car/Engine package.
So. McLaren have an advantage as in the ECU was developed to suit their car. Ferrari, BMW, Toyota etc have to write software to suit.
Prodrive have a standard ECU map for PPP. Doesn't mean every WRX/STI fitted with it will perform the same does it?
Imagine if the FIA had said Ferrari are to develop a standard ECU for all cars. McLaren would be the first to protest.
If there was any advantage, it woul dhave been extremely short lived and certainly a non-issue by the time it came to first race. Lets not forget, Ferrari were absolutely monstering everyone right up until the firstu qualifying session where I feel the tactics of keeping drivers in until there were just 3 mins to go was as much to blame as anything else. And in the race Raikonnen had the pace, but, not the skill.
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And another thing - these teams have millions of dollars to spend on R&D - if they don't have an intimate knowledge of what exactly that standard ECU is all about through detailed testing and analysis, then they have no one but themselves to blame.
Unless of course Ron has somehow engineered a "**** you" line of code in there somewhere that only he can activate by remote control....
Unless of course Ron has somehow engineered a "**** you" line of code in there somewhere that only he can activate by remote control....
To be honest, I think FIA just picked the ecu supplier out of a hat, or took the cheapest bidders offer!
Mclaren would have had an advantage at the start of testing, fact. The idea being that all the other teams would have enough time to catch up. The time spent getting upto speed on a brand new ecu has obviously cost crucial development time in other areas.
If you honestly think that dropping a new ecu in an F1 car is the same as a road car, you are seriouisly deluded.
#25
The FIA wouldn't have awarded the tender to McLaren if they weren't satisfied that there would be no advantage to the McLaren team.
There's a hell of a lot of supposition going on in this thread. How do you know, for example, that the ECU was developed for the Mercedes engine? It was almost certainly designed to specs given to them by the FIA. There will also be checking involved to ensure that ECUs are equal.
There's a hell of a lot of supposition going on in this thread. How do you know, for example, that the ECU was developed for the Mercedes engine? It was almost certainly designed to specs given to them by the FIA. There will also be checking involved to ensure that ECUs are equal.
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The teams have had the specs of the new ECU for a long time, (they didn't just get them a week before testing), and the ECU is different to the one that was in the mclaren last year, so they didn't have a huge advantage over the competition. It was developed by a Mclaren company in conjunction with Microsoft from specs proposed and vetted by the FIA. It was not developed by the race team themselves or Mercedes.
I've seen a few interviews with other team principals, engineers etc about the subject, and they have all (apart from Ferrari) said that it is not giving mclaren an advantage as they have already worked out how to use the new chip, (something which they did quite quickly).
After the fiascos of last year with spygate etc, I really don;t think the FIA would allow anything which would give mclaren an unfair advantage this year...
I've seen a few interviews with other team principals, engineers etc about the subject, and they have all (apart from Ferrari) said that it is not giving mclaren an advantage as they have already worked out how to use the new chip, (something which they did quite quickly).
After the fiascos of last year with spygate etc, I really don;t think the FIA would allow anything which would give mclaren an unfair advantage this year...
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The FIA wouldn't have awarded the tender to McLaren if they weren't satisfied that there would be no advantage to the McLaren team.
There's a hell of a lot of supposition going on in this thread. How do you know, for example, that the ECU was developed for the Mercedes engine? It was almost certainly designed to specs given to them by the FIA. There will also be checking involved to ensure that ECUs are equal.
There's a hell of a lot of supposition going on in this thread. How do you know, for example, that the ECU was developed for the Mercedes engine? It was almost certainly designed to specs given to them by the FIA. There will also be checking involved to ensure that ECUs are equal.
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Originally Posted by chrispurvis100
To be honest, I think FIA just picked the ecu supplier out of a hat, or took the cheapest bidders offer!
Originally Posted by chrispurvis100
Mclaren would have had an advantage at the start of testing, fact. The idea being that all the other teams would have enough time to catch up. The time spent getting upto speed on a brand new ecu has obviously cost crucial development time in other areas.
If you honestly think that dropping a new ecu in an F1 car is the same as a road car, you are seriouisly deluded.
Also the teams have known about the single ecu solution for ages, so if they were organised (which ferrari undoubtably are) would have solutions ready to put into place
Ferrari just need to holds their hands ups and say they werent good enough on the day instrad of trying to blame others.
(wonder if the safety car would have come out as many times if ferrari were leading and mclaren were well behind )
Last edited by jaytc2003; 19 March 2008 at 02:57 PM.
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If there was any advantage, it woul dhave been extremely short lived and certainly a non-issue by the time it came to first race. Lets not forget, Ferrari were absolutely monstering everyone right up until the firstu qualifying session where I feel the tactics of keeping drivers in until there were just 3 mins to go was as much to blame as anything else. And in the race Raikonnen had the pace, but, not the skill.
To be fair though, I haven't said I think the ECU was to blame for Ferrari's performance in Austrailia. Personally, I think they just got the weekend wrong. Kimi was very fast when in clear air. Silly mistakes cost him the race, and all the time sat in dirty air wouldn't have done the cooling for the engine any good at all. This is peobably what caused the failure.
I still think the McLaren do have an advantage with the ECU. All team apposed the introduction of standard ECU's, but the FIA pushed through with it, on written assurances from McLaren that the ECU development company is a seperate entity from McLaren F1.
All teams cheat, bend the rules. That is F1 for you. If it had been a Ferrari ECU developed ECU in the McLaren and the Mclaren's engine went pop, you can sure as hell bet that McLaren would be blaming the Ferrari ECU for the failures. That's F1.