Sonic'

Read about this in the paper today

Seems he has been suspended for his comments on euthanasia as a means to cut the cost of caring for vulnerable /disabled children.

Rightly so too, he should be sacked imo

Euthanasia remark Tory suspended - Yahoo! News UK

pwhittle

that's actually more worrying than an MP saying it, as councilors make decisions about local cases and funding policies

rossyboy

iTrader: (8)

In some of the most severe cases, you really do wonder what the point of them living is though.

I'm talking about the ones that require 24 hour care, cannot do a thing for themselves and have zero communication with the world around them.

Wurzel

iTrader: (1)

Why only restrict it to vulnerable/disbaled kids? I know some adults that could do with Euthanising!!!!!

David Lock

Sounds to me like the guy was joking.

But of course humour is not allowed in 2008

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Bit of a taboo that really, but it does get you thinking that in some cases it could be justified, someone in constant pain with no enjoyment of life and massive cost to keep them alive, for what, to drag out a pretty miserable life using resources that could be used to help somebody who has a shot at a better life.

I think sometimes that care can be the cruelest option, but its a decision we cannot make for someone else, even if we could we risk prosecution and it always leave the vulnerable open to just being offed for money or convenience.

Leslie

I have to say that I disagree totally with that. I firmly believe that life should be preserved as far as possible despite the problems and to suggest deliberately killing someone in such a situation is grossly immoral.

You only have to look ahead to the future in such a "Brave New World" to see the awful possibilities of stretching the type of case that that would almost certainly apply to as well for the convenience of others.!

Life is a gift to an individual and others should never have the right to take it away from an innocent person who cannot stand up for himself.

Les

Suresh

Joking about putting kids to death??


The stuck-up Tory mong should be put to death himself! (joke)

rossyboy

iTrader: (8)

I didnt suggest that we start killing them and I agree it would be virtually impossible to know where to draw the line.

I just suggested that in some circumstances there appears to be no quality of life. It would be impossible to know that for sure though, unless you are in the position of the disabled person. Catch 22.

Also, whats the difference between a severely disabled animal and a severely disabled human? They both have the gift of life and yet we feel superior enough to take away the animals life because it might be suffering...or we dont have the resources to take care of it.

Suresh

Poor analogy to be honest. We humans kill around 100 billion animals a year for food. We very clealy don't consider animal lives to anywhere near equal to the value of human lives.

rossyboy

iTrader: (8)

I was thinking more along the lines of animals that are not eaten, such as pets, though I see your point obviously.

Geezer

Even when it mean terrible suffering for the person involved?

Some people are in a vegetative state, there really is no point prolonging it, it's not like some severly disabled people who can still be happy or tell what is going on around them. Some people are basically bodies that do nothing except p*ss and sh*t, you could cut off their heads and keep the body alive and you would see no appreciable difference.

Sorry to be blunt, but there it is.

Geezer

rossyboy

iTrader: (8)

Thats what I was getting at, but using a more subtle approach

Leslie

Yes but what would you propose should be done in the case that you quote. You have to come down on one side or the other. I have to say that in my case I would also find it difficult to kill a disabled pet too. You may think that is "soft" but I have to admit to being very much pro-life.

That is the only answer I can give to you also Geezer, and there have been cases where seriously ill people have even recovered to be able to have some quality of life even against the prognoses from the medical experts.

Les

Geezer

I know what you're saying, but I'm not talking about people who are in comas or recovered from brain injuries, these are people who are "conscious" but are profoundly disabled, they are not going to recover, they are born like that, there is nothing to recover to, if that makes sense. They do not, and never will have any perception of themselves or the world around them.

Geezer

rossyboy

iTrader: (8)

I suppose if I had to decide, I would say that where a persistant vegetative state has occured since birth or following an accident/severe illness for say 5 years, then euthanasia would be acceptable to me.

I dont think your views on animals is soft at all. The reason I brought up the animal argument was that I feel they are not given the respect and treatment they deserve by a hell of a lot people across the world.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

For an MP in a party headed by someone with a disabled son, that was an particularly silly comment to make!

Would be evidence of poor judgment on the part of a public figure on the best of occasions.

Ns04

Leslie

Yes true enough Geezer, but could you personally bring yourself to kill a person in that position? And is it fair to a doctor to order him to take a life? That is the very opposite to what his life's work is dedicated to.

The very fact that a person cannot communicate makes it impossible to find out how they would feel about it and I dont think we would have the right to make that decision for them.

Les