NotoriousREV

Has anyone been watching this for the last couple of weeks? I only watch it for the opportunity to shout at the TV. Last nights was a classic. Builder quotes £42k fixed price for a job, complains the job is going to bankrupt him so asks for another £4k then promptly abandons the job. The TV crew arrive to "mediate" and he then says he's worked it all out carefully and all he needs is £18,500 + VAT to finish the job! He then ****s about for another 3 weeks until he walks off the job after his clients complain he hasn't actually done anything and refuse to make a part payment.

Seriously, is there any other industry where this kind of working practice would survive? If I underquoted for a job it'd be tough **** on me but builders seem to think it's the clients problem when they **** it up.

mrtheedge2u2

I think builders should be all made to work wearing a 10 gallon hats

richardg

...and spurs

i haven't watched it. i am a chartered surveyor and have in the past been responsible for managing residential and retail developments. i have come across this sort of thing all the time, but with the contracts we used (ie proper contracts; jct wcd and minor works agreements), the terms are all very clear. i certainly wouldn;t employ a builder to work on my house without some form of contract and i certainly wouldn't pay them a "deposit".

i don;t know the detail of the programme last night, but if i were the client, i would be looking at some form of action against the builder. in theory (and again, i don;t know the detail), but there may be scope for employing another builder to finish off and then going after the original builder for the difference between the agreed cost and final cost. ways and means...

speedking

They were working under JCT, but the client had misinterpreted the wording.

The contract said "Paid weekly for work completed." They thought that meant when a whole task was complete they would pay for it, and refused part payments if something was say 50% complete. The arbitrator found in favour of the builder that he should be paid pro rata for work he had done, whether the individual tasks were complete or not.

The builders looked a right shower but legally were in the right.

richardg

...shows the value of using a professional

people don;t read things and then think they know what they're signing. sad, but very common and can be a very costly mistake

NotoriousREV

Thing is, the JCT was only set up after he'd walked off the job originally (it was in place for the additional £18.5k's worth of work, not the original £45k), they had nothing in place prior to that. The clients worded the JCT themselves and failed to write what they meant.

The one the week before was as bad. Builder was 7 weeks late but refused to accept the penalties that were in the contract and couldn't understand why the clients were so pissed off with them.

PeteBrant

It did say that the builder declared the company insolvant 3 months after filming, so you reap what to sew.

boxst

The problem is that was probably to just get rid of money outstanding / work to do that they have been paid for or to skip any court actions.

Steve

richardg

all too common unfortauntely

i worked for a contractor earlier this year and had gone there to set up a development division. unfortunately, the company were owed money (retention - so no question as to whether it was or wasn't due as the final accounts had been agreed for the relevant projects) and the client refused to pay...hence the company went into liquidation

silly thing is that if the client had paid, the income would have more than covered the debts the company had. unfortunately though, the debts were all contractors and subbies - no overdraft (there was actually money in the bank) so once again, it's the little man that suffered

austinwrx

but the couple were a right pair of idiots. there wasn't 45k's worth of work there.

the builder was at fault though- he was useless in every manner. what professional needs money up front for materials. he'd have a trade account, pay at end of month etc.

vindaloo

I saw that one. Classic case of non-communication. I don't know if the builder was the same honest, quiet person off camera, but he came across as quiet, honourable and thoughtful. She came across as a right old gorgon.

Interesting how the arbitrater managed to nail the sum owed so exactly. Both in money terms, and in emotional terms. He managed quite a coup. Gave the builder a decent amount, commented the quality of the work. And the couple rounded the amount up to £3K, presumably because of the positive vibe.

J.

astraboy

Exactly, when dealing with builders you just have to remember the following phrase:
"A builders work is never done. Especially when he's paid up front"
astraboy.

j4ckos mate

we have gutted the bathroom it cost us £3k, and was half of what some builders wanted.

the downside is he can talk for england, we have been staying late at work and not going home, as soon as he sees you he downs tools and wants to chat, its taken him over 5 weeks, but he has to be finished today,
to give you an idea what five weeks plus is like we went to turkey on the 14 of july for a week and expected it to be done when we got back.,
i must say though he has done a superb job, and is a frioend of my wives family but i wish we had told him we were putting it up for sale or something to hurry him up along a bit

Andy Tang

iTrader: (3)

A mediator who is more interested in the media than any sort of mediation!

He was a waste of space and it was he who stressed that they should pay for completed tasks. Also it was down to the client to abide by the rules, but no consequence if the builder didn't.

I haven't seen such one sided horse **** in a long time. You can tell the mediator works in the building trade and it sounded like he only had the interests of the builder in mind.

NotoriousREV

Bingo, Andy. I thought it was disgusting that the mediator told them to set up the JCT but didn't ensure that the JCT was actually worded to cover what both parties actually agreed to!

They should sue Channel 4.

On the other hand, I do know 2 good builders who do what they say they'll do, when they say they'll do it for the price they quoted. Unfortunately one is emigrating to America and the other lives too far away for it to be worth his while doing work at my house.

A mate of mine had an extension done 2 years ago. The builder didn't finish the job and then sent an invoice for £25k (the outstanding amount that was due at completion). Strangely, after a few "words" the builder hasn't tried to actually get his money.

NotoriousREV

On now, Ch4