What no thread praising the PMs G20 success?
02 April 2009, 10:20 PM
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What no thread praising the PMs G20 success?
Well in the name of balance, and as not exactly a big fan of his, I say job well done. Of course time will tell the real impact of these measures but he done good I think
02 April 2009, 10:27 PM
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I say well done to Gordon for arranging it and getting the US president along!
I don't like the desperate dan jawed scot, but fair play to him for getting this off the ground.
I don't like the desperate dan jawed scot, but fair play to him for getting this off the ground.
02 April 2009, 10:38 PM
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Copied here to save you the 'click' ...
" ... Britain has as its Prime Minister a master of political illusion. He may not be much of an orator, but there is no one better at dressing up old money as new. If the G20 nations wanted to fake progress, to spin a $1.1 trillion figure while committing no new money at all, then Gordon Brown is their man. “This is the day that the world came together to fight the global recession, not with words but with a plan,” said our Dear Leader. Well, let’s have a closer look at this supposed plan…
1) “Making available an extra $1 trillion”. Ahh, those Brown verbal tricks. What does “make available” mean? Is it guarantees, promises, statement of intent? Real spending? Not a penny of cold hard cash has been pledged by anyone. The sum is concocted by taking the IMF’s pre-existing $500bn target for its bailout fund (a target it still hasn’t met) added to this new $250bn that the IMF may or may not decide to print, plus $250bn in supposed trade guarantees.
2) IMF Funds “treble to $750 billion”. Very fishy. We heard from the IMF on Valentine’s Day that it wanted double its rescue fund to $500 billion – then it said it wanted even more. So where has the extra $250bn come from? Who has stumped it up? No one, it appears: the idea is that the IMF would print this money, in its own pretend “currency” (called Special Drawing Rights or SDR), and then allow its members to swap this for real money. The idea was once rejected by US Congress, but Obama thinks he won’t need congressional approval now the limit is kept to $250bn. But to be clear: no one has stumped up any new cash. It’s a little quantitative easing for the world – aimed, I suspect, at Eastern Europe. China will be happy as it wants SDRs to replaced the US dollar as a reserve currency.
3) Old pledges dressed as new. Brown gave a breakdown of who had stumped up: Japan, he said, contributed $100bn to the IMF. Yes it did: in January. The EU has agreed to contribute $100bn, he added. We know: this was announced at the last EU summit. Brown said China has chipped in just $40bn, and this appears to be new. But given the size of Beijing’s $2 trillion piggy bank, that is a rather derisory amount (and won’t buy it a seat on the IMF board). The Brazilians had thought China was good for $100bn.
4) Double counting. The Dear Leader has good news. “We are going to act decisively to kickstart international trade” But how? “We will ensure availability of at least $250 billion over the next two years." This $250bn was thrown in to make up his $1.1bn headline – and “over two years” means that this is $125bn, double counted. Why not make it four years, and whack up an extra $1 trillion? It’s just a joke. Nor is this real cash – it comes from trade insurance schemes to protect importers and exporters. It’s not money being spent by governments. Pure Brown-style fiscal conjuring.
5) Tax havens. “We have agreed there will be an end to tax havens that do not transfer secrecy on request.” This is a piggybacking on the long-running OECD campaign against tax havens – this is not a G20 initiative. Brown solemnly announced the OECD would publish a list of non-compliant nations, as if this were a breakthrough. It has been doing this for the last year – here is a list of the most recent such announcements.
6) “The Washington consensus is over”. A curious aside from Brown – and a dog whistle to the Soros/Naomi Klein school of economics. The so-called “Washington Consensus” doesn’t refer to any formal economic protocol. It is used by the likes of Soros to denote what he calls ‘free market fundamentalism’. The academic who coined the term talks about its abuse here.
7) Ban on new trade barriers. Yeah, right. They agreed this in November and, since then, 17 of the 20 countries have increased trade barriers.
8) Brown’s gold advice: “I’ve been proposing this to the IMF for ten years”. He was certainly proposing in 1999 that the IMF sold gold – then priced at $278 an ounce. Luckily, the IMF ignored Brown and gold is now $890 an ounce. Shame he didn’t take the IMF’s advice when it was warning his borrowing would end in tears.
9) “For the first time, we have come together to set principles for the global finance system.” As far as I can determine, all they have agreed is that banks and hedge funds should be regulated – but don’t say how. Ergo, it’s meaningless.
10) No fiscal stimulus. It’s mentioned twice in the 3,080 word document – there wasn’t one. Both Brown and Obama wanted the world to contribute new money. They failed. There was none of the big agreement that Brown led us to believe. There was a split, as evidenced by the Franco-German minority report yesterday. But still it’s a big summit, a deal was done (albeit a fairly nebulous one) and the threatre was fine.
On a presentational basis, this his has worked out well for Brown. I suspect the G20 will be written up well tomorrow, just as his Budgets are always written up well – “2p tax reduction!” – before we all realise we’ve been swindled. So look out for triumphant declarations of “$1.1 trillion to save the world” in tomorrow’s papers. Listening to Brown today, it was as if he were giving a Budget for the world. And I suspect the world is about to learn how illusory a Brown promise really is .... ".
So, in terms of 'job well done? Yep, the usual Brown 'smoke and mirrors but don't read the small print' job maybe. 'cos we're getting softened up for an IMF bailout any time now ... apparently on Channel4 news earlier (from http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/for...topic=110179):
" ... Anyone watching Mandelson on Channel 4 news will know what I am talking about.
"We won't be at the top of the queue"
Snow pushes him - "You didn't say we won't be in the queue"
"I don't think we will be in the queue"
Honestly he didn't want to say that last bit. He was more or less forced to. Very sheepish and quiet whan he said it.
All this after Mandelson spent a good minute talking about how the stigma of going to the IMF was being reduced and it wouldn't be embarressing to go to them now. He even used examples of other countries, Mexico, that were considering using the special drawdown facility. We are being primed. Pure and simple. Just as we were for low interest rates and QE ... "
The sh)t is really about to hit the fan. Nu Labia's chickens are coming home to roost!
Dave
Last edited by hutton_d; 02 April 2009 at 10:46 PM.
02 April 2009, 10:38 PM
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Agree to new trade financing so lots of lending
02 April 2009, 10:43 PM
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Im not sure that the amount of time money and energy, not to mention CO2, used to bring all these people together for an afternoon of chatting is truly justifyable.
Given the quality of video conferencing etc these days, im sure another 2-3 days could have been spent talking over a connection, rather than all the travelling etc.
Call my a cynic, but im not convinced. Not to mention had all the leaders not been in the UK a further X million would not have been needed on policing the unwashed window breakers either.
Im sure it has achieved great things (other than the queen getting an ipod and Jamie Oliver cooking a slap up British meal for them all) but im yet to be convinced it warranted all these resources. Would love to know the carbon footprint of the past 2-3 days.
Given the quality of video conferencing etc these days, im sure another 2-3 days could have been spent talking over a connection, rather than all the travelling etc.
Call my a cynic, but im not convinced. Not to mention had all the leaders not been in the UK a further X million would not have been needed on policing the unwashed window breakers either.
Im sure it has achieved great things (other than the queen getting an ipod and Jamie Oliver cooking a slap up British meal for them all) but im yet to be convinced it warranted all these resources. Would love to know the carbon footprint of the past 2-3 days.
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02 April 2009, 10:50 PM
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See G20 summit: Gordon Brown strikes historic $1 trillion deal - Telegraph for an overview .. which tells you nothing! For something that explains a bit more how about Brown's illusory G20 deal | Coffee House
Copied here to save you the 'click' ...
" ... Britain has as its Prime Minister a master of political illusion. He may not be much of an orator, but there is no one better at dressing up old money as new. If the G20 nations wanted to fake progress, to spin a $1.1 trillion figure while committing no new money at all, then Gordon Brown is their man. “This is the day that the world came together to fight the global recession, not with words but with a plan,” said our Dear Leader. Well, let’s have a closer look at this supposed plan…
1) “Making available an extra $1 trillion”. Ahh, those Brown verbal tricks. What does “make available” mean? Is it guarantees, promises, statement of intent? Real spending? Not a penny of cold hard cash has been pledged by anyone. The sum is concocted by taking the IMF’s pre-existing $500bn target for its bailout fund (a target it still hasn’t met) added to this new $250bn that the IMF may or may not decide to print, plus $250bn in supposed trade guarantees.
2) IMF Funds “treble to $750 billion”. Very fishy. We heard from the IMF on Valentine’s Day that it wanted double its rescue fund to $500 billion – then it said it wanted even more. So where has the extra $250bn come from? Who has stumped it up? No one, it appears: the idea is that the IMF would print this money, in its own pretend “currency” (called Special Drawing Rights or SDR), and then allow its members to swap this for real money. The idea was once rejected by US Congress, but Obama thinks he won’t need congressional approval now the limit is kept to $250bn. But to be clear: no one has stumped up any new cash. It’s a little quantitative easing for the world – aimed, I suspect, at Eastern Europe. China will be happy as it wants SDRs to replaced the US dollar as a reserve currency.
3) Old pledges dressed as new. Brown gave a breakdown of who had stumped up: Japan, he said, contributed $100bn to the IMF. Yes it did: in January. The EU has agreed to contribute $100bn, he added. We know: this was announced at the last EU summit. Brown said China has chipped in just $40bn, and this appears to be new. But given the size of Beijing’s $2 trillion piggy bank, that is a rather derisory amount (and won’t buy it a seat on the IMF board). The Brazilians had thought China was good for $100bn.
4) Double counting. The Dear Leader has good news. “We are going to act decisively to kickstart international trade” But how? “We will ensure availability of at least $250 billion over the next two years." This $250bn was thrown in to make up his $1.1bn headline – and “over two years” means that this is $125bn, double counted. Why not make it four years, and whack up an extra $1 trillion? It’s just a joke. Nor is this real cash – it comes from trade insurance schemes to protect importers and exporters. It’s not money being spent by governments. Pure Brown-style fiscal conjuring.
5) Tax havens. “We have agreed there will be an end to tax havens that do not transfer secrecy on request.” This is a piggybacking on the long-running OECD campaign against tax havens – this is not a G20 initiative. Brown solemnly announced the OECD would publish a list of non-compliant nations, as if this were a breakthrough. It has been doing this for the last year – here is a list of the most recent such announcements.
6) “The Washington consensus is over”. A curious aside from Brown – and a dog whistle to the Soros/Naomi Klein school of economics. The so-called “Washington Consensus” doesn’t refer to any formal economic protocol. It is used by the likes of Soros to denote what he calls ‘free market fundamentalism’. The academic who coined the term talks about its abuse here.
7) Ban on new trade barriers. Yeah, right. They agreed this in November and, since then, 17 of the 20 countries have increased trade barriers.
8) Brown’s gold advice: “I’ve been proposing this to the IMF for ten years”. He was certainly proposing in 1999 that the IMF sold gold – then priced at $278 an ounce. Luckily, the IMF ignored Brown and gold is now $890 an ounce. Shame he didn’t take the IMF’s advice when it was warning his borrowing would end in tears.
9) “For the first time, we have come together to set principles for the global finance system.” As far as I can determine, all they have agreed is that banks and hedge funds should be regulated – but don’t say how. Ergo, it’s meaningless.
10) No fiscal stimulus. It’s mentioned twice in the 3,080 word document – there wasn’t one. Both Brown and Obama wanted the world to contribute new money. They failed. There was none of the big agreement that Brown led us to believe. There was a split, as evidenced by the Franco-German minority report yesterday. But still it’s a big summit, a deal was done (albeit a fairly nebulous one) and the threatre was fine.
On a presentational basis, this his has worked out well for Brown. I suspect the G20 will be written up well tomorrow, just as his Budgets are always written up well – “2p tax reduction!” – before we all realise we’ve been swindled. So look out for triumphant declarations of “$1.1 trillion to save the world” in tomorrow’s papers. Listening to Brown today, it was as if he were giving a Budget for the world. And I suspect the world is about to learn how illusory a Brown promise really is .... ".
So, in terms of 'job well done? Yep, the usual Brown 'smoke and mirrors but don't read the small print' job maybe. 'cos we're getting softened up for an IMF bailout any time now ... apparently on Channel4 news earlier (from Ch 4 News - We Are Going To The Imf... - House Price Crash forum
" ... Anyone watching Mandelson on Channel 4 news will know what I am talking about.
"We won't be at the top of the queue"
Snow pushes him - "You didn't say we won't be in the queue"
"I don't think we will be in the queue"
Honestly he didn't want to say that last bit. He was more or less forced to. Very sheepish and quiet whan he said it.
All this after Mandelson spent a good minute talking about how the stigma of going to the IMF was being reduced and it wouldn't be embarressing to go to them now. He even used examples of other countries, Mexico, that were considering using the special drawdown facility. We are being primed. Pure and simple. Just as we were for low interest rates and QE ... "
The sh)t is really about to hit the fan. Nu Labia's chickens are coming home to roost!
Dave
Copied here to save you the 'click' ...
" ... Britain has as its Prime Minister a master of political illusion. He may not be much of an orator, but there is no one better at dressing up old money as new. If the G20 nations wanted to fake progress, to spin a $1.1 trillion figure while committing no new money at all, then Gordon Brown is their man. “This is the day that the world came together to fight the global recession, not with words but with a plan,” said our Dear Leader. Well, let’s have a closer look at this supposed plan…
1) “Making available an extra $1 trillion”. Ahh, those Brown verbal tricks. What does “make available” mean? Is it guarantees, promises, statement of intent? Real spending? Not a penny of cold hard cash has been pledged by anyone. The sum is concocted by taking the IMF’s pre-existing $500bn target for its bailout fund (a target it still hasn’t met) added to this new $250bn that the IMF may or may not decide to print, plus $250bn in supposed trade guarantees.
2) IMF Funds “treble to $750 billion”. Very fishy. We heard from the IMF on Valentine’s Day that it wanted double its rescue fund to $500 billion – then it said it wanted even more. So where has the extra $250bn come from? Who has stumped it up? No one, it appears: the idea is that the IMF would print this money, in its own pretend “currency” (called Special Drawing Rights or SDR), and then allow its members to swap this for real money. The idea was once rejected by US Congress, but Obama thinks he won’t need congressional approval now the limit is kept to $250bn. But to be clear: no one has stumped up any new cash. It’s a little quantitative easing for the world – aimed, I suspect, at Eastern Europe. China will be happy as it wants SDRs to replaced the US dollar as a reserve currency.
3) Old pledges dressed as new. Brown gave a breakdown of who had stumped up: Japan, he said, contributed $100bn to the IMF. Yes it did: in January. The EU has agreed to contribute $100bn, he added. We know: this was announced at the last EU summit. Brown said China has chipped in just $40bn, and this appears to be new. But given the size of Beijing’s $2 trillion piggy bank, that is a rather derisory amount (and won’t buy it a seat on the IMF board). The Brazilians had thought China was good for $100bn.
4) Double counting. The Dear Leader has good news. “We are going to act decisively to kickstart international trade” But how? “We will ensure availability of at least $250 billion over the next two years." This $250bn was thrown in to make up his $1.1bn headline – and “over two years” means that this is $125bn, double counted. Why not make it four years, and whack up an extra $1 trillion? It’s just a joke. Nor is this real cash – it comes from trade insurance schemes to protect importers and exporters. It’s not money being spent by governments. Pure Brown-style fiscal conjuring.
5) Tax havens. “We have agreed there will be an end to tax havens that do not transfer secrecy on request.” This is a piggybacking on the long-running OECD campaign against tax havens – this is not a G20 initiative. Brown solemnly announced the OECD would publish a list of non-compliant nations, as if this were a breakthrough. It has been doing this for the last year – here is a list of the most recent such announcements.
6) “The Washington consensus is over”. A curious aside from Brown – and a dog whistle to the Soros/Naomi Klein school of economics. The so-called “Washington Consensus” doesn’t refer to any formal economic protocol. It is used by the likes of Soros to denote what he calls ‘free market fundamentalism’. The academic who coined the term talks about its abuse here.
7) Ban on new trade barriers. Yeah, right. They agreed this in November and, since then, 17 of the 20 countries have increased trade barriers.
8) Brown’s gold advice: “I’ve been proposing this to the IMF for ten years”. He was certainly proposing in 1999 that the IMF sold gold – then priced at $278 an ounce. Luckily, the IMF ignored Brown and gold is now $890 an ounce. Shame he didn’t take the IMF’s advice when it was warning his borrowing would end in tears.
9) “For the first time, we have come together to set principles for the global finance system.” As far as I can determine, all they have agreed is that banks and hedge funds should be regulated – but don’t say how. Ergo, it’s meaningless.
10) No fiscal stimulus. It’s mentioned twice in the 3,080 word document – there wasn’t one. Both Brown and Obama wanted the world to contribute new money. They failed. There was none of the big agreement that Brown led us to believe. There was a split, as evidenced by the Franco-German minority report yesterday. But still it’s a big summit, a deal was done (albeit a fairly nebulous one) and the threatre was fine.
On a presentational basis, this his has worked out well for Brown. I suspect the G20 will be written up well tomorrow, just as his Budgets are always written up well – “2p tax reduction!” – before we all realise we’ve been swindled. So look out for triumphant declarations of “$1.1 trillion to save the world” in tomorrow’s papers. Listening to Brown today, it was as if he were giving a Budget for the world. And I suspect the world is about to learn how illusory a Brown promise really is .... ".
So, in terms of 'job well done? Yep, the usual Brown 'smoke and mirrors but don't read the small print' job maybe. 'cos we're getting softened up for an IMF bailout any time now ... apparently on Channel4 news earlier (from Ch 4 News - We Are Going To The Imf... - House Price Crash forum
" ... Anyone watching Mandelson on Channel 4 news will know what I am talking about.
"We won't be at the top of the queue"
Snow pushes him - "You didn't say we won't be in the queue"
"I don't think we will be in the queue"
Honestly he didn't want to say that last bit. He was more or less forced to. Very sheepish and quiet whan he said it.
All this after Mandelson spent a good minute talking about how the stigma of going to the IMF was being reduced and it wouldn't be embarressing to go to them now. He even used examples of other countries, Mexico, that were considering using the special drawdown facility. We are being primed. Pure and simple. Just as we were for low interest rates and QE ... "
The sh)t is really about to hit the fan. Nu Labia's chickens are coming home to roost!
Dave
02 April 2009, 10:57 PM
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03 April 2009, 08:36 AM
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This government got us into this mess ,how the **** does flash think he can get us out .I can only see them digging a bigger hole for us all .
03 April 2009, 09:23 AM
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Well, they've come up trumps again. Martin2005, this simplifies things so maybe you can understand what has happened ..... G20 PRODUCES ONE TRILLION DOLLARS FROM BEHIND YOUR EAR - The Daily Mash
Dave
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03 April 2009, 10:10 AM
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I did love the opening speech though, that mentioned it was the biggest gathering of world leaders to deal with a financial situation in many many years....
Given the size of the problem, its hardly suprising, and hardly anything to boast about surely.
I would love to know how much was spent on decorating the Excel for the meeting, and other such lavish squanderings of money.
Jamz3k, thats about the size of it mate. And the best part is, they have all agreed they are all gonna do this again in a few months in someone elses country. Seems to be an OTT afternoon new mums tea meeting!
Given the size of the problem, its hardly suprising, and hardly anything to boast about surely.
I would love to know how much was spent on decorating the Excel for the meeting, and other such lavish squanderings of money.
Jamz3k, thats about the size of it mate. And the best part is, they have all agreed they are all gonna do this again in a few months in someone elses country. Seems to be an OTT afternoon new mums tea meeting!
03 April 2009, 10:30 AM
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The point being that you immediately default to slam 'Nu Labia' mode?
The point that given a choice you immediately go off and find the negative spin rather than the positive?
Which other point have I missed?
Look I know that Brown is going to get hammered at the next election, and rightly so, but that doesn't make everything he's ever done bad.
It might be easier to take contributions more seriously if you showed even slightest whiff of fairness or balance in your posts
The point that given a choice you immediately go off and find the negative spin rather than the positive?
Which other point have I missed?
Look I know that Brown is going to get hammered at the next election, and rightly so, but that doesn't make everything he's ever done bad.
It might be easier to take contributions more seriously if you showed even slightest whiff of fairness or balance in your posts
03 April 2009, 10:45 AM
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As a PR exercise the G20 was a success. Obama got his European lift-off, and McMental got his desperation-generated General Election photocall-portfolio-boost (lathered-on make-up, phoney grin and all).
And the trillion of money boost? Well, perhaps a jobbing printer or IT conjuror made a bob or two - but as for the beef in the magic sandwich, we shall just have to wait and see as we bite and chew on it.
My money is on the whole thing falling apart as soon as the suited cheerleaders get back home to their various welcoming parades or mud-slinging events. (we all know what usually happens to McMental inspired initiatives, don't we?)
And the trillion of money boost? Well, perhaps a jobbing printer or IT conjuror made a bob or two - but as for the beef in the magic sandwich, we shall just have to wait and see as we bite and chew on it.
My money is on the whole thing falling apart as soon as the suited cheerleaders get back home to their various welcoming parades or mud-slinging events. (we all know what usually happens to McMental inspired initiatives, don't we?)
Last edited by unclebuck; 03 April 2009 at 10:46 AM.
03 April 2009, 11:09 AM
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The point being that you immediately default to slam 'Nu Labia' mode?
The point that given a choice you immediately go off and find the negative spin rather than the positive?
Which other point have I missed?
Look I know that Brown is going to get hammered at the next election, and rightly so, but that doesn't make everything he's ever done bad.
It might be easier to take contributions more seriously if you showed even slightest whiff of fairness or balance in your posts
The point that given a choice you immediately go off and find the negative spin rather than the positive?
Which other point have I missed?
Look I know that Brown is going to get hammered at the next election, and rightly so, but that doesn't make everything he's ever done bad.
It might be easier to take contributions more seriously if you showed even slightest whiff of fairness or balance in your posts
Negative spin - sorry, but just pointing out that Flash is not saying anything new, just rehashing old announcements as new, is just pointing out the facts. And he has a long history of this.
Other point? Well, you said 'job well done' for Flash. I 'pointed' out the spin etc in his statement, and that in my opinion that it was NOT a job well done, and you totally ignored them. Even though they were answering your original post ... doh .....
Balance? Seems I've got the balance right IMHO. If Flash, or his cronies, ever did anything positive foir the electorate, rather than themselves, I'd acknowledge it.
Dave
03 April 2009, 11:37 AM
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Nu Labia 'slamming' - well, they're in power and the ones scr3wing up.
Negative spin - sorry, but just pointing out that Flash is not saying anything new, just rehashing old announcements as new, is just pointing out the facts. And he has a long history of this.
Other point? Well, you said 'job well done' for Flash. I 'pointed' out the spin etc in his statement, and that in my opinion that it was NOT a job well done, and you totally ignored them. Even though they were answering your original post ... doh .....
Balance? Seems I've got the balance right IMHO. If Flash, or his cronies, ever did anything positive foir the electorate, rather than themselves, I'd acknowledge it.
Dave
Negative spin - sorry, but just pointing out that Flash is not saying anything new, just rehashing old announcements as new, is just pointing out the facts. And he has a long history of this.
Other point? Well, you said 'job well done' for Flash. I 'pointed' out the spin etc in his statement, and that in my opinion that it was NOT a job well done, and you totally ignored them. Even though they were answering your original post ... doh .....
Balance? Seems I've got the balance right IMHO. If Flash, or his cronies, ever did anything positive foir the electorate, rather than themselves, I'd acknowledge it.
Dave
As for the spin on the outputs of the meeting, of course there are things in here that are not new. But there is plenty that is. The markets know it, which is why they're up.
There are plenty of articles out there praising the PMs handling of the G20...why didn't you post any of those up ...in the name of balance obviously?
SO please NEVER lecture ME on being balanced...just don't
Last edited by Martin2005; 03 April 2009 at 11:42 AM.
03 April 2009, 01:09 PM
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I wasn't lecturing anyone. YOU were the one who said I was posting unbalance comments. As ever you argue different things in consecutive posts, whilst all the time ignoring direct, or indirect, questions and arguments that give the lie to what you are saying.
Why??? When they're responsible for a lot of the cack we're in. And give BILLIONS to their cohorts responsible for the rest.
Dave
03 April 2009, 01:15 PM
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A good couple of days? Everything is relative .... I can't handler it? I couldn't really give a t*55 that he's 'had a good couple of days', he's still runing this country, and has been ever since 1997! Something you can't seem to handle ...
I wasn't lecturing anyone. YOU were the one who said I was posting unbalance comments. As ever you argue different things in consecutive posts, whilst all the time ignoring direct, or indirect, questions and arguments that give the lie to what you are saying.
Why??? When they're responsible for a lot of the cack we're in. And give BILLIONS to their cohorts responsible for the rest.
Dave
I wasn't lecturing anyone. YOU were the one who said I was posting unbalance comments. As ever you argue different things in consecutive posts, whilst all the time ignoring direct, or indirect, questions and arguments that give the lie to what you are saying.
Why??? When they're responsible for a lot of the cack we're in. And give BILLIONS to their cohorts responsible for the rest.
Dave
Remember it's not me who uses playground language to describe politics..IT'S YOU!
03 April 2009, 01:25 PM
#24
Scooby Regular
Well, they've come up trumps again. Martin2005, this simplifies things so maybe you can understand what has happened ..... G20 PRODUCES ONE TRILLION DOLLARS FROM BEHIND YOUR EAR - The Daily Mash
Dave
Dave
03 April 2009, 01:42 PM
#25
Guest
Posts: n/a
As funny as the Daily Mash? Sorry, not in their league. In general? I'm a lazy typist so if I see someone else has bothered to write something I agree with then 'cut n paste' is so much easier. Always meant to learn to touch type but never got around to it ....
Martin: why is it that in just about every thread you contribute to people accuse you of ignoring their points/questions? Not just me ....
Dave
Martin: why is it that in just about every thread you contribute to people accuse you of ignoring their points/questions? Not just me ....
Dave
03 April 2009, 02:16 PM
#26
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One of the most telling comments came from a BBC commentator yesterday. He said that is was just like a budget, as we have seen often enough over recent years.
Never bother to come to any conclusions on the first day, the first week, or even the first month. It will take at least as long as that to realise what they have really done!
I think the main point is that that money which is magically going to be made available comes from "special drawing rights" which is another term for printing money!
We will all be paying that money back for years to come in extra taxes and so will our children and granchildren!
It all comes to whether you think it is a good idea to borrow trillions so that it can be spent in a profligate manner and be paid back over the far distant future and all caused by greedy money men and lax regulation even though they could see it all happening!
It was also a shameful act by this load of plonkers in charge to overborrow for years, flog off our gold reserves, encourage the people to borrow themselves into gross debt, just to make it appear that the man in charge of the money was being "prudent"
Les
Never bother to come to any conclusions on the first day, the first week, or even the first month. It will take at least as long as that to realise what they have really done!
I think the main point is that that money which is magically going to be made available comes from "special drawing rights" which is another term for printing money!
We will all be paying that money back for years to come in extra taxes and so will our children and granchildren!
It all comes to whether you think it is a good idea to borrow trillions so that it can be spent in a profligate manner and be paid back over the far distant future and all caused by greedy money men and lax regulation even though they could see it all happening!
It was also a shameful act by this load of plonkers in charge to overborrow for years, flog off our gold reserves, encourage the people to borrow themselves into gross debt, just to make it appear that the man in charge of the money was being "prudent"
Les
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