BlkKnight

Situation:

I work for a mail order company who takes orders over the phone.

Early in November a customer places an order for a treadmill, pays by card with delivery to a a different address to which the card is registered.

The bank verify that the card is registered at the address given.

We send the goods out & they are signed for.

Three weeks later the bank inform us the owner of the card has disputed the transaction - That's us down £1200.


Now, on the 15th of November, we receive another order (different addresses & card details) for the same product - again the card holders address matches - and we send the goods out.

Fortunately the card holder spotted the transaction and called us before the goods were delivered.

The mobile number from where both orders were raised is the same.

(And before anyone says, we have changed copmany policy to stop this happening again.)

So the Offender is waiting for delivery of the goods, I have his phone number & am able to call him to meet the van driver at the delivery address - I thought a pretty good situation in which to catch the *******.

This is where is gets crap. . . .

Yesterday at 9am I spend 90 minutes on the phone giving the details to Thames Valley Police - outcome was they would forward the details onto Met Police as the crime was about to be committed their district.

3pm - No news yet - I ring Met Pol, they inform me that the victim of the crime was based in Thames Valley - so Thames Valley should be dealing with the crime.

I then call Thames Valley who politely tell me that Met Police were talking out of their **** and gave me a number of the local station to call directly.

Call the local station and inform them of the situation. They pass the details onto their control desk & advise me that I'll get a call back shortly.


5:15 I call the control desk chasing, they check the logs and tell me that a CID chap has spoken to all parties concerned and that no resources were available - I had not received a call. . .


I then call the thief this morning, explaining that the delivery van has broken down.


9am: I call the Met Pol control office again and get put through to the CID bloke. He advises me that Met Pol do not have the resources to deal with the crime and tells me to speak to Thames Valley as the crime originates in their area. . . . (can you see a pattern arising?)

I then speak to Thames Valley who are furious about Met Pol's actions and are now chasing it up. . . . .

FlightMan

Its your own fault. If you'd committed a traffic offence, then you'd have been swamped by the Police.

https://www.scoobynet.com/non-scooby...gs-police.html

dazdavies

iTrader: (22)

And the police wonder why their name is mud.

Had similar when my gran got burgled got the we havent got the resources to attend bollocks. about 30 minutes later I drove past a police camera van on my way to my grans and slowed down and blatently gave the bloke the finger. I sh*t you not an hour later there's a knock at my door with TWO officers giving me a hard time for the finger incedent. I quickly explained the situation about my gran and told them to f*ck off which to be fair they duly did.

Police arent interested in proper crime, just traffic offences it would appear.

The police need a massive PR campaign they could start by actually dealing with matters instead of finding any excuse not to.

OP, go to the press with this one, they'll have a field day with it!

I await for those BiB to come on here and defend the indefensible.

LG John

My wife is a dog warden.

The police called her and asked her to help them to trap a stray dog that was running amuck.

She attended but it was busy and was forced to park on double yellows.

She spent a while with the police getting the dog.

Meanwhile they issued her with a parking ticket.

She phoned and explained she was in attendance with the police to catch a dog that was causing traffic chaos, etc.

They won't revoke the ticket.

Nuff said.

LG John

P.S. when they phone and ask for help now she tell them they are on their own.....and secretely hopes they get mauled

Snazy

I would assume the police would judge it on its merits.
Police will turn up, no credit card will be found, person who takes receipt will just say they were asked to wait in for it, original purchaser will never be found.

As simple and clear cut as it is, no person will ever get charged with the offence, and ultimatly the police would be there to recover the item you knowingly sent to a fraudulant address.

We get thousands of pounds worth of fraud shipments a week where I work, and the police just like to know names used, card numbers and addresses operated from. Usually this will all be collated until they can actually make an arrest and charge someone.

Very frustrating I agree, but you have to look at the legal angle too. 6 cops, a few hours inc paperwork, maybe an arrest on a petty charge, only to be bailed and usually disappear into the night.

When you say the delivery address did not match the card, but the bank verified the address given as the card holders address.. .. Do you mean that the delivery address and cardholder address were both given as different addresses, but the address given as the cardholders address was verified?

Im shocked a bank would allow a £1200 transaction without flagging it, especially mail order. And especially as you have had to flag it to THEM to verify addresses etc.

Snazy

Police issued ticket or local authority?
Everyone knows local authority wardens are idiots! They uphold tickets to ambulance ffs lol!

BlkKnight

Yes, the credit card holders address was verified - and we sent to a different address.

I'm pretty furious about this, but I guess I'll just chalk it up to experience.

Re the signing for the goods - because the thief wants us to book in the job so that he can meet the van personally to take the goods off, there is a good chance that the person taking delivery is the actual thief?

LG John

It was the police themselves that issued it and won't revoke it.

Jerome

If my limited experience of the Met is anything to go by, this is par for the course.

They seem to be averse to actually investigating crime (that doesn't involve some form of revenue generation). Quite what they spend their time doing when not collecting revenue is a mystery to me.

LC Geezer

Police are just victims of idiotic targets. When you are measured on arrest rates rather than the quality of the nick, and your job depends on hitting the targets, what are you going to go for? Easy nick or a hard nick? And the CPS won't prosecute if there is the slightest chance of not getting a conviction. There is disincentive to pursue cases such as this. Don't blame front line officers - blame the beaurocrats.

Also, work load is far higher than you'd imagine. I've seen 4 hour delays on i-calls (an i-call is immediate response) just because people are tied up with nonsense calls and the inevitable 2 hour booking in delay in custody and 2 hours paperwork for a simple arrest (which ususally results in no charges being brought anyway).

Snazy

Problem is, identifying and proving who the actual person is carrying out the fraud. They are unlikely to have used their own name, actually unusual to use their own address. Usually a short term rental or a place of work, or the old classic, meet the delivery driver at the door and say the person is out but you will sign for it.
Wait outside an address you know will be empty all day. Just happen to arrive as the courier does, offer to take it for them (quoting the recip by name as they are neighbours) Wait for the driver to drive away..... Load up and off they go.

Because of the complex way these people work it is almost impossible to get charges to stick, unless they are monitored, and evidence gathered.

Like I say, it sucks for the victims, but the CPS does not make these cases easy to get a conviction, and the fraudsters know damn well.
And because of that, the police are reluctant to make arrests.

Like LC says, blame the makers and breakers of the laws not the ones on the front line enforcing them.

SaxoBoy, thats rediculous mate, I dont blame you for being pi$$ed at that

Jerome

Presumably, the next time she is called to help the police, she will spend some time finding somewhere to park so she doesn't get a ticket. Hopefully several hours...

Xx-IAN-xX

I would of thought catching a thief would be high on their merit list.Then again maybe not

Snazy

I think you have missed the whole point of the reply.
My point is, they will "swoop" to find "a person". Unrelated, unable to prove they are connected, and not really possible to arrest.

These might be low life scum theif criminals... But they use their smarts.

As I say, there will be no way to connect the person at the address, or who signs for it, to the actual fraud.

Its all very well to say arrest them, but what are you going to charge them with?

dpb

Would any policeman be happy being a competant bureaucrat ?

fatscoobfella1

iTrader: (1)

We had a similar situation a few years ago...

Were based in Cheshire and sent out a pair of £3000 hifi speakers for a customer to evaluate. We had done this many times before,taking a customers details,driver licence details and birth certificate stuff as well as proof of living at actual address..We had never encountered a problem,and had actually met the guy at a hifi show previously.

Cut a long story short,he tried to sell them on Ebay...We saw this and tried to contact him,all phones were down and no replies to e mail..
We got in touch with our local police and they in turn told us to get in touch with the met,as the guy was from Muswell Hill and they would have to deal with it.

Many phone calls were made and basically the met didnt want anything to do with it.. We told them that we had a friend in London who was gonna bid for the speakers and win them..When address details were given or delivery arranged,then we would be there personally to recieve them.... They said that they didnt heve the resources to turn up.. But we told them that when we arrived in London,we would check in at the local nick to fill them in on what was gonna happen. At the end of the day,there was quite a few variables,and nobody knew what was gonna happen when this guy was confronted...

So off we drove to the big smoke to waited for this sting to happen..The seller had arranged to deliver the speakers to our friends address... So we waited and waited until he did..
Finally on turning up,we fronted the guy who basically sh@t himself and just wanted out of the situation asap.. I wasnt gonna let him get away scott fee,so rang the local nick and informed them that the scammer had turned up,we had retrieved our goods and had the guy by the collar..

We was told "not to take matters into our own hands",but they hadnt the manpower to turn out and we must let him go as we couldnt keep people against there will,as it could be misconstrued as kidnap..

What a waste of bones,fat and skin most bobbies are...

Were doing there bloody job for them and catching the criminals and they cant even be bothered to turn up..Too bloody busy with there ANPR's do doubt...

fatherpierre

So we're all in agreement, that the police are ****/useless/fine gatherers?

Thank God for that

cster

Well you've certainly changed your tune!
Just goes to show that the majority always knows best.

madscoob

iTrader: (3)

should find out where he works as the only way he could get all someone elses details if either he is a postman or works in a shop where you have to hand over all your details for a purchase ie a tv in currys, word of advice never do this i work in a retail job and have worked out the customer gives me everthing thats needed to commit card fraud
card no
start date
exp date
security no
name
address
and postcode
it would be a piece of p1ss for me to do this phone up a company order a hifi supply retailer with all the above details and then say could you please deliver the goods to my brother in law as its a present. why would the retailer suspect me as i have been able to supply all the card holders details over the phone. i would have money on him working in a shop or he is a postman

Snazy

I could not agree more!

lol dont be like that, im sure there is one or 2 good ones out there
Serious though, on the OP, would you agree that there would be little grounds for an arrest?

stilover

Hire a van, employ the services of a few mates, and phone the chap to "Meet the delivery driver"

Drag the ****** into the back of the van and dish out a little justice of your own.

Leslie

I get the impression that these days the Police are so obsessed with fulfilling the targets set for them by our masters that they consider that is of greater importance than actually protecting the public and/or solving or preventing crime. Their senior officers who are responsible for their application to the job appear to be more interested in presenting the right answers to the politicians to their own advantage and have forgotten what we actually pay them for!

Les

Snazy

Agreed Les, but I dont blame the cops for chasing their targets. Their job relys on it.
Its a shame that almost every walk of life is "measured" in this way now.

Next up, the fire service will be rated on some daft goal so they dont attend shed and garage fires etc.

ScoobyWon't

Chasing motorists? Nope. Not in Notts, the senior staff are too busy shoplifting

Senior police officer arrested on suspicion of shoplifting

And it's not the first time this one has been caught...

Snazy

Oh dear. Im glad there were enough resources to make this arrest

ScoobyWon't

You'd think all the cop-haters on here would start a petition to get her sacked as it doesn't set a good example or help build the reputation of the force.

Then again, it's a lose-lose situation. I'd hate to have been the OIC. Imagine if you got a conviction - "Well done. Get rid of the prisoner and pick up your P45 on the way out"

Snazy

lol im sure a petition will follow. Maybe Clownwatch can sort one out. With its mass following, im sure the UK will be behind it in no time.

lol yeah bit of an awkward situation that eh. You're nicked.......maam!

Leslie

I think you are right Snazy and that is what I meant of course.

Target driven employment is the only method that those who are incompetent at employing and dealing with people in the workplace can use and is at the heart of so much of our present problems as well as being a very expensive affair.

It removes attention from the real job in hand, makes people cut corners and kills any pride in the work which needs to be done.

Les

fatherpierre

The OP's post doesn't actually say whether the 2nd lot of items were paid for before delivery carried out. If they were paid via a card that is pukka then there's no theft.

You can't prove fraud until it's actually happened. If the card is genuine and being used by its owner then the issue is with the CC company allowing transaction reversal.

The ownership of the crime is an odd one. It is usually the victim's address that is used for the venue of the crime unless the venue of where the crime took place is proven beyond doubt. I do see how it is infuriating for victims of this sort of crime when ownership is batted about.

The initial crime appears to have been facilitated by the CC company and they should be held to account.