The Premiership twists and turns again...
27 April 2002, 06:41 PM
#1
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Congratulations to Spurs for providing a banana skin for one of our title contenders to slip up on.
Now need Bolton to do the biz at the Reebok on Monday, and the Premiership will be back to its usual shape, with the mighty Man Utd. favourites to win the title.
You know it's going to happen....
<Flame Suit On>
Now need Bolton to do the biz at the Reebok on Monday, and the Premiership will be back to its usual shape, with the mighty Man Utd. favourites to win the title.
You know it's going to happen....
<Flame Suit On>
27 April 2002, 06:51 PM
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Not happy
A little bit more cheerful than at 1 oclock coz Ive had a couple of tinnies.
Just watchin them mancs cheating again... ba5t4rd5[img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]
A little bit more cheerful than at 1 oclock coz Ive had a couple of tinnies.
Just watchin them mancs cheating again... ba5t4rd5[img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]
27 April 2002, 09:10 PM
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Cheeting fookin Man Utd as usual!!!! [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img] Not one non Utd football supporter, and more importantly tv commentators, as far as I have seen or heard has said it was even close to a penalty! If Van Nistlerooy wants to take dives like that he should p!ss off and play in Italy or Spain! Are the FA and Refs bent on giving as much help as possible to Man Utd to win the championship??? It is a total joke that a penalty can be given for that incident, yet when Ipswich players were bundled over no penalties or free kicks were given in comparison! I have never seen any team get as much help and protection from refs as Man Utd get! [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img] [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img] [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]
27 April 2002, 11:36 PM
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Yeah, right. 
Of course, it's a well known fact the Man Utd players are the ONLY players to take a dive.
And defenders NEVER give attackers little shoves in the back in the penalty area.
And ever title United have won over the last decade has been the result of cheating, 'cause there's a massive conspiracy within the FA to get Man Utd to win every year. This is also why Man Utd are near the top of the Fair Play table, and Arsenal, for example, are near the bottom. It's OBVIOUS that this has nothing to do with the way the teams play, 'cause everybody KNOWS that Man Utd cheat.
Get real.
Get that chip off your shoulder.
And start talking sense.
Of course, it's a well known fact the Man Utd players are the ONLY players to take a dive.
And defenders NEVER give attackers little shoves in the back in the penalty area.
And ever title United have won over the last decade has been the result of cheating, 'cause there's a massive conspiracy within the FA to get Man Utd to win every year. This is also why Man Utd are near the top of the Fair Play table, and Arsenal, for example, are near the bottom. It's OBVIOUS that this has nothing to do with the way the teams play, 'cause everybody KNOWS that Man Utd cheat.
Get real.
Get that chip off your shoulder.
And start talking sense.
28 April 2002, 01:19 AM
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OK so 2 replies saying the same thing from supporters of different clubs yet the Man Utd supporter says everyone else is wrong and it wasn't a dive and Man Utd are just perfect! Sounds just like any other Man Utd supporter to me! 
Didn't see Liverpool cheating against Spurs to get a result. I so hope we (THE GOONERS) come to Old Trafford and put the ghosts to rest and win the championship there! Although I guarantee the ref will give all decisions to Utd as usual!
Didn't see Liverpool cheating against Spurs to get a result. I so hope we (THE GOONERS) come to Old Trafford and put the ghosts to rest and win the championship there! Although I guarantee the ref will give all decisions to Utd as usual!
28 April 2002, 01:45 AM
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Oh yeah, United get all the decisions
Heard a joke on the radio a while back about united getting loads of penalites and someone rang in and calmly told the bloke all the statistics from that season, United had been awarded less penaltys than anyone else, that didnt half shut the presenter up...
I agree he made the most of it, and Ipswich should of had a few decisions there way, but there was definetly some shoving.
Heard a joke on the radio a while back about united getting loads of penalites and someone rang in and calmly told the bloke all the statistics from that season, United had been awarded less penaltys than anyone else, that didnt half shut the presenter up...
I agree he made the most of it, and Ipswich should of had a few decisions there way, but there was definetly some shoving.
28 April 2002, 02:01 AM
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Andi
On a serious note I think the worst thing is that there is never any consistency, not just with Utd but with most games week in week out. Referees land themselves in hot water by letting one team get away with something they penalise the other team for. It just doesn't make any sense, and as for their arguement of they didn't see it, well they have two linesman as well, and if none of the 3 see an incident then it shows something is going on or how **** the officiating in this country really is!
As for the Man Utd result, I am more frustrated at what it will mean to Ipswich rather than Arsenal, Arsenal have it in their hands to win it and don't need to rely on other teams results, however that decision today which I will insist was wrong no matter what may well cost Ipswich their place in the Premiership! How fair is that cos of a bl00dy dive by an immensely talented player who should have known better! I just hope Ipswich are not relegated on this result as that will be totally out of order.
On a serious note I think the worst thing is that there is never any consistency, not just with Utd but with most games week in week out. Referees land themselves in hot water by letting one team get away with something they penalise the other team for. It just doesn't make any sense, and as for their arguement of they didn't see it, well they have two linesman as well, and if none of the 3 see an incident then it shows something is going on or how **** the officiating in this country really is!
As for the Man Utd result, I am more frustrated at what it will mean to Ipswich rather than Arsenal, Arsenal have it in their hands to win it and don't need to rely on other teams results, however that decision today which I will insist was wrong no matter what may well cost Ipswich their place in the Premiership! How fair is that cos of a bl00dy dive by an immensely talented player who should have known better! I just hope Ipswich are not relegated on this result as that will be totally out of order.
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28 April 2002, 11:11 AM
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Typical response of a Man Utd hater. No facts, just opinionated bull$#it.
I say "Of course, it's a well known fact the Man Utd players are the ONLY players to take a dive".
You respond "the Man Utd supporter says everyone else is wrong and it wasn't a dive and Man Utd are just perfect".
Where exactly did I say any of that? Can you actually read? If you are going to respond to my comments, would you please actually read what they are first. I'm not surprised I sound like "any other Man Utd supporter" - you just listen to the voice in your head, and not to what people are ACTUALLY SAYING!
For the record - I think United were VERY LUCKY to get the penalty awarded. I'm not saying it was a dive (although I'm not saying it wasn't). I've seen penalties given for less, and I've seen penalties not given for more blatant fouls. I therefore DON'T think "everybody else" is wrong (although I'm interested to know how you've managed to poll the opinion of at least a representative cross section of the community within such a short space of time. Or is "Everybody Else" just a synonym for "my fellow Man Utd haters"?
But I also think that if Utd HADN'T got the penalty, they would still have ultimately won the game. And that even if Ipswich had drawn the game (or even won it), they would STILL go down, because I can't see them getting any result at Anfield other than a good thrashing, whereas Sunderland have a REALLY tough tie at home to Derby.
Man Utd are NOT perfect. (When we get our defence sorted - then we'll be perfect)
We went through a dire period before Christmas which means we will be VERY LUCKY to win the Premiership this year. However, the fact that we are still in with a chance despite a period with one win in 7 games shows how well we've done for the rest of the season.
Arsenal are on a storming run of form. Their football has been breathtaking at times, especially their forward play and midfield creativity. If that form continues, they will win the title and they will deserve it, because over the course of the season they will have been the better team.
But I still think Man United are the better team. Why? BECAUSE I'M A MAN UTD SUPPORTER AND THAT'S MY JOB!
I say "Of course, it's a well known fact the Man Utd players are the ONLY players to take a dive".
You respond "the Man Utd supporter says everyone else is wrong and it wasn't a dive and Man Utd are just perfect".
Where exactly did I say any of that? Can you actually read? If you are going to respond to my comments, would you please actually read what they are first.
I'm not surprised I sound like "any other Man Utd supporter" - you just listen to the voice in your head, and not to what people are ACTUALLY SAYING!For the record - I think United were VERY LUCKY to get the penalty awarded. I'm not saying it was a dive (although I'm not saying it wasn't). I've seen penalties given for less, and I've seen penalties not given for more blatant fouls. I therefore DON'T think "everybody else" is wrong (although I'm interested to know how you've managed to poll the opinion of at least a representative cross section of the community within such a short space of time. Or is "Everybody Else" just a synonym for "my fellow Man Utd haters"?
But I also think that if Utd HADN'T got the penalty, they would still have ultimately won the game. And that even if Ipswich had drawn the game (or even won it), they would STILL go down, because I can't see them getting any result at Anfield other than a good thrashing, whereas Sunderland have a REALLY tough tie at home to Derby
.Man Utd are NOT perfect. (When we get our defence sorted - then we'll be perfect
)We went through a dire period before Christmas which means we will be VERY LUCKY to win the Premiership this year. However, the fact that we are still in with a chance despite a period with one win in 7 games shows how well we've done for the rest of the season.
Arsenal are on a storming run of form. Their football has been breathtaking at times, especially their forward play and midfield creativity. If that form continues, they will win the title and they will deserve it, because over the course of the season they will have been the better team.
But I still think Man United are the better team. Why? BECAUSE I'M A MAN UTD SUPPORTER AND THAT'S MY JOB!
28 April 2002, 11:19 AM
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Arsenal at the bottom of the fair play league. Yep, 'cos they get the bookings they deserve. The red b*stards on the other hand get away with f*cking everything. Van Nistlerooy's response in the interview afterwards confirmed it.
Those cheating red b*stard's season would be over if it wasn't for a couple of sick penalty decisions and a fluke deflection.
Makes me f*cking sick.
Those cheating red b*stard's season would be over if it wasn't for a couple of sick penalty decisions and a fluke deflection.
Makes me f*cking sick.
28 April 2002, 12:34 PM
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Of course I can. I do deny it. Absolutely 100%.
As a United fan, I think every decision should go their way. Every time they don't get a decision in their favour, it annoys me. It happens every game - several times per game.
And every time the opposition get a decision in their favour, that annoys me too. And they seem to get lots of dubious decisions, every single game.
But I'm honest enough to realise that the reason I feel this way is because I'm supporting MY team, and my perspective of the game is naturally biased. This isn't because I'm a Man Utd supporter - I'm sure it's the same for every supporter of every team.
You, on the other hand, as another obvious Man Utd Hater, see things from the opposite perspective. You will naturally prostitute your support to whichever team Utd are playing against, and so will always see Utd as the villains, wrongly getting decisions in their favour etc.
You're just not smart/honest enough to realise that your perspective is also very, very biased.
[Edited to add a smilie to (hopefully) show I don't mean to be too insulting]
[Edited by dharbige - 4/28/2002 12:36:35 PM]
As a United fan, I think every decision should go their way. Every time they don't get a decision in their favour, it annoys me. It happens every game - several times per game.
And every time the opposition get a decision in their favour, that annoys me too. And they seem to get lots of dubious decisions, every single game.
But I'm honest enough to realise that the reason I feel this way is because I'm supporting MY team, and my perspective of the game is naturally biased. This isn't because I'm a Man Utd supporter - I'm sure it's the same for every supporter of every team.
You, on the other hand, as another obvious Man Utd Hater, see things from the opposite perspective. You will naturally prostitute your support to whichever team Utd are playing against, and so will always see Utd as the villains, wrongly getting decisions in their favour etc.
You're just not smart/honest enough to realise that your perspective is also very, very biased.
[Edited to add a smilie to (hopefully) show I don't mean to be too insulting]
[Edited by dharbige - 4/28/2002 12:36:35 PM]
28 April 2002, 12:57 PM
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I dont agree that United get any more decisions than they should, I've lost count of how many times I've been to old trafford and spent the whole game cursing at the referee for making stupid decisions...
28 April 2002, 01:36 PM
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One thing I will say -
Even if Arsenal DO win the title, this season has been the best for years. A three way title race going into the last few games, in the best league in the world - football just doesn't get any better than this.
Even if Arsenal DO win the title, this season has been the best for years. A three way title race going into the last few games, in the best league in the world - football just doesn't get any better than this.
28 April 2002, 02:04 PM
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dharbige,
May I draw your attenion to my reply to fastbloke in a previous thread when accused similarly:
"Fastbloke - Another good point and I accept when United are playing, by default I support the opposition. This is because I am a City fan from Manchester and we have this thing called rivalry."
Stu.
Alright Dave.......you red b*stard
May I draw your attenion to my reply to fastbloke in a previous thread when accused similarly:
"Fastbloke - Another good point and I accept when United are playing, by default I support the opposition. This is because I am a City fan from Manchester and we have this thing called rivalry."
Stu.
Alright Dave.......you red b*stard
28 April 2002, 02:24 PM
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Kippax,
No problem. I'm not objecting to your position as a Man Utd Hater. It's your choice.
I was objecting to your refering to Man Utd as "cheating red b*stard[s]", and was contending your statement that I could not deny that Man U. get more decisions for them than against them.
Changing the subject slightly, I'm quite glad that City have made their bi-annual trip to the Premiership again for next season. It just means Utd have another easy 6 points...
No problem. I'm not objecting to your position as a Man Utd Hater. It's your choice.
I was objecting to your refering to Man Utd as "cheating red b*stard[s]", and was contending your statement that I could not deny that Man U. get more decisions for them than against them.
Changing the subject slightly, I'm quite glad that City have made their bi-annual trip to the Premiership again for next season. It just means Utd have another easy 6 points...
28 April 2002, 02:37 PM
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Hmm I notice all these people complaining about united getting a debatable penalty decision didn't see fit to post about the West Ham goal that wasn't allowed when the ball clearly crossed the Arsenal goal line on wednesday night. Or the fact that Liverpool defender Henchoz deliberatley used his hands twice to deny Arsenal clear goal scoring opportunities in last years FA cup final (he even admitted it in interviews afterwards) But then that wouldn't support the myth that all officials and the FA want to hand the title to united would it? There are numerous examples of debatable decisions made by referees but only those that seem to benefit united are debated in public with such passion - in wonder why that is?
>>>> I just hope Ipswich are not relegated on this result as that will be totally out of order.
Erm, since when did a single game result in any team being relegated? If Ipswich do get relegated then it will be because they have not won enough of their 38 league games they will have played at the end of the season to justify their Premiership status.
>>>> Those cheating red b*stard's season would be over if it wasn't for a couple of sick penalty decisions and a fluke deflection. Makes me f*cking sick.
Nice to know you care so much about us mate Here's hoping we get a few "dodgy" decisions against you in the derby!
There are numerous examples of debatable decisions made by referees but only those that seem to benefit united are debated in public with such passion - in wonder why that is? >>>> I just hope Ipswich are not relegated on this result as that will be totally out of order.
Erm, since when did a single game result in any team being relegated? If Ipswich do get relegated then it will be because they have not won enough of their 38 league games they will have played at the end of the season to justify their Premiership status.
>>>> Those cheating red b*stard's season would be over if it wasn't for a couple of sick penalty decisions and a fluke deflection. Makes me f*cking sick.
Nice to know you care so much about us mate
Here's hoping we get a few "dodgy" decisions against you in the derby!
28 April 2002, 03:08 PM
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I love these threads with the obligatory "6 points in the derby's next season", positioned delicately at the end of each response.
As long as its understood that that's as potentially upsetting as calling you home counties boys armchair reds (FM excepted).
As long as its understood that that's as potentially upsetting as calling you home counties boys armchair reds (FM excepted).
28 April 2002, 04:22 PM
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I was born in Manchester (well, Oldham if I'm completely honest, but that's Greater Manchester ), and have been a United fan since I was 6.
I don't see why I should stop supporting Man U., just because I don't live there anymore.
[Edited by dharbige - 4/28/2002 4:22:53 PM]
), and have been a United fan since I was 6.I don't see why I should stop supporting Man U., just because I don't live there anymore.
[Edited by dharbige - 4/28/2002 4:22:53 PM]
28 April 2002, 04:25 PM
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Did I say you should stop supporting them????
You are a proper united fan then good
I grew up in a school where all united fans had never been to Manchester, it really annoyed me.
I had a Villa season ticket up until three years ago. Work commitments and college commitments got in the way (and I am boycotting Ellis, ELLIS OUT!!!!)
Cheers,
Michelle
You are a proper united fan then good
I grew up in a school where all united fans had never been to Manchester, it really annoyed me.
I had a Villa season ticket up until three years ago. Work commitments and college commitments got in the way
(and I am boycotting Ellis, ELLIS OUT!!!!)Cheers,
Michelle
28 April 2002, 04:34 PM
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The point I make about Ipswich going down on this decision is due to the 1 point they should have had and didn't get! That 1 point could be the difference between staying or going! Thats the point!! Of course they are where they are due to a poor season but that doesn't automatically mean bad decisions dont matter any more and they deserve to go down! They deserved a point from the game and if its that lost point that causes them to drop then its due to a cheating Man Utd player and that is far from fair!
As for so many people hating Man Utd??? Well its nothing to do with success, its the fact they get away with murder on the pitch compared to other teams. Compare the two best midfielders in the country, Vieira and Keane. Keane gets away with far more in terms of the aggression he shows referees for example, video replays constantly show him having a go at refs where as Vieira gets booked for the slightest show of dissent. Some of the tackles Keane gets away with are amazing, yet Man Utd are near the top of the Fair Play awards, I wonder why, its because Keane doesn't get the same treatment as Vieira or other hard tackling midfielders in the Premiership. I am so glad you mentioned the Fair Play league as it just shows the difference in how referees treat Man Utd compared to Arsenal, both teams tackle hard and commit equally as many fouls in a game but looks who is picked up for it, Arsenal! Man Utd get away with far more and if you deny it you are the blind ones, not the rest of the Premiership fans!
As for the West Ham goal that wasn't allowed against Arsenal, yes it was a goal but its the first bit of luck I can remember Arsenal having, like already mentioned look at the FA Cup Final last year where we were robbed!
As for so many people hating Man Utd??? Well its nothing to do with success, its the fact they get away with murder on the pitch compared to other teams. Compare the two best midfielders in the country, Vieira and Keane. Keane gets away with far more in terms of the aggression he shows referees for example, video replays constantly show him having a go at refs where as Vieira gets booked for the slightest show of dissent. Some of the tackles Keane gets away with are amazing, yet Man Utd are near the top of the Fair Play awards, I wonder why, its because Keane doesn't get the same treatment as Vieira or other hard tackling midfielders in the Premiership. I am so glad you mentioned the Fair Play league as it just shows the difference in how referees treat Man Utd compared to Arsenal, both teams tackle hard and commit equally as many fouls in a game but looks who is picked up for it, Arsenal! Man Utd get away with far more and if you deny it you are the blind ones, not the rest of the Premiership fans!
As for the West Ham goal that wasn't allowed against Arsenal, yes it was a goal but its the first bit of luck I can remember Arsenal having, like already mentioned look at the FA Cup Final last year where we were robbed!
28 April 2002, 04:38 PM
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In no way WHATSOEVER am I sticking up for Man Urinal, but I think we should start looking at the people giving the decisions rather than whinging at the teams???
Didn't we see this happening in the glory days of Liverpool with "The Kop Penalty"?????
I am a qualified referee and have to admit that sometimes decisions that are made by Premiership refs are beyind me!!!!
Didn't we see this happening in the glory days of Liverpool with "The Kop Penalty"?????
I am a qualified referee and have to admit that sometimes decisions that are made by Premiership refs are beyind me!!!!
28 April 2002, 04:48 PM
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It's amazing how you can twist the facts to fit your conclusions.
Fact: Man Utd are near the top of the Fair Play table.
Fact: Arsenal are near the bottom.
Possible Conclusion 1: Man Utd play more fair than Arsenal.
Possible Conclusion 2: Man Utd are cheats who get away with murder; there is an FA conspiracy that favours Man Utd; Referees pick on Arsenal players
Do you know how ridiculous this sounds? The anti-United bias is so obvious as to make your arguments laughable!
Fact: Man Utd are near the top of the Fair Play table.
Fact: Arsenal are near the bottom.
Possible Conclusion 1: Man Utd play more fair than Arsenal.
Possible Conclusion 2: Man Utd are cheats who get away with murder; there is an FA conspiracy that favours Man Utd; Referees pick on Arsenal players
Do you know how ridiculous this sounds? The anti-United bias is so obvious as to make your arguments laughable!
28 April 2002, 04:57 PM
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Chelle,
I'm sure that you would agree that all "refereeing" decisions are easier with the benefit of several camera angles and instant slow motion replays.
Referees not perfect, and they do get decisions wrong, but they have to make them in a split second with only one look at an incident.
Being a Premiership referee doesn't mean that you are infallible - it just means that you are very experienced, and very fit.
Anyway, almost totally off topic, but as a qualified referee I have a question for you -
Why is a late challenge on a striker who has taken a shot on goal not considered a foul? I see it all the time (and not just for Man Utd) - a striker gets clattered/brought down just AFTER he has taken a shot; the shot misses/is saved, but no foul is given for the late challenge.
Anywhere else on the pitch and it would be a free kick, and possible booking.
Why is that?
I'm sure that you would agree that all "refereeing" decisions are easier with the benefit of several camera angles and instant slow motion replays.
Referees not perfect, and they do get decisions wrong, but they have to make them in a split second with only one look at an incident.
Being a Premiership referee doesn't mean that you are infallible - it just means that you are very experienced, and very fit.
Anyway, almost totally off topic, but as a qualified referee I have a question for you -
Why is a late challenge on a striker who has taken a shot on goal not considered a foul? I see it all the time (and not just for Man Utd
) - a striker gets clattered/brought down just AFTER he has taken a shot; the shot misses/is saved, but no foul is given for the late challenge.Anywhere else on the pitch and it would be a free kick, and possible booking.
Why is that?
28 April 2002, 04:58 PM
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No it doesn't sound ridiculous, and that opinion includes friends and work colleagues of most who do not like Arsenal one little bit, but you as a Man Utd supporter are blind as a bat when it comes to being realistic with comparing what your players get away with and other teams treatment by refs. And your comment about its your job to support your team and not ever disagree with decisions given in your favour just highlights your ignorance of whats right and wrong with decisions given in the Premiership. I had no doubt whatsoever that it was a wrong decision given against West Ham the other night, I support Arsenal to the very end but I will not be as blind to say that was a correct decision, I would have prefered the goal to have been given and for Arsenal to come back and win the game fairly! That is why so many have problems with Man Utd, cos they wont hold their hands up and say it was a wrong decision and they have been very lucky!!!
28 April 2002, 05:04 PM
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Okay, I can't answer for all referees as you must know that each decision is made in a split second.
(If you want to be become a quick decision maker, become a referee)
Your point about slow motion replays etc I would like to see introduced into professional refereeing. There is nothing worse than seeing a goal disallowed when on an action replay it actually DID cross the line.
With regards to your question, if I saw a late challenge that IMO contravened the laws of the FA then I would take action accordingly.
I know exactly what you mean and have been bewildered by the lack of action taken.
On the actual pitch you have limited views. In junior football you cannot rely at all on your *linesmen* as they are usually parents and not exactly the most non-biased of people
In a professional match you have neutral *linesmen* and can rely on them, but all the same, they too have limited views. the only thing I can think of is that in the view of the referee and *linesmen* the tackle did not look as severe as it did on camera.
Does that help?
(If you want to be become a quick decision maker, become a referee
)Your point about slow motion replays etc I would like to see introduced into professional refereeing. There is nothing worse than seeing a goal disallowed when on an action replay it actually DID cross the line.
With regards to your question, if I saw a late challenge that IMO contravened the laws of the FA then I would take action accordingly.
I know exactly what you mean and have been bewildered by the lack of action taken.
On the actual pitch you have limited views. In junior football you cannot rely at all on your *linesmen* as they are usually parents and not exactly the most non-biased of people
In a professional match you have neutral *linesmen* and can rely on them, but all the same, they too have limited views. the only thing I can think of is that in the view of the referee and *linesmen* the tackle did not look as severe as it did on camera.
Does that help?
28 April 2002, 05:18 PM
#30
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Bravo,
Once again, you have demonstrated your ability to judge me as a Man Utd fan by opinion in your head, and not on the evidence in front of you.
In this very thread, earlier today, I wrote "I think United were VERY LUCKY to get the penalty awarded".
Guess you missed that, did you?
Oh, and I said it was my job as a supporter to think of Man Utd as the better team, not to think that every decision given for them is correct.
Once again, you have demonstrated your ability to judge me as a Man Utd fan by opinion in your head, and not on the evidence in front of you.
In this very thread, earlier today, I wrote "I think United were VERY LUCKY to get the penalty awarded".
Guess you missed that, did you?
Oh, and I said it was my job as a supporter to think of Man Utd as the better team, not to think that every decision given for them is correct.