Mad4it

I have just ordered a new Type R Honda Civic.

I drove the car a while ago, and was very pleased with its drivability, performance and handling, but was wondering if anybody had any opinions about the car, and any tuning modifications that they could recommend???

LG John

Do some searches and you'll find there are a number of type r owners on here. I think they are great cars and would have one if I wanted a FWD hot-hatch. Not too sure about the gear-stick position though!

IWatkins

Nice car, looking at one myself. 200bhp without a turbo ? Erm, yes please.

Honda BBS

P1Fanatic

Gear stick position looks bizarre but after a 90 min test drive I was loving it. Is totally natural feeling and is one of, if not, the slickest boxes Ive ever used. Great package but the looks put me off - looks too normal and mpv like for my taste. Petrol consumption isnt much better than a scoob either.

Mossman

A friend has one in black and looks superb. Very quick indeed and a great gearbox, as everyone says.
Felt a bit twitchy at the back (we had a MASSIVE moment on a fast left hander!). A really nice car.
Mossman

Magic Boot

I've now done 15,000 miles in my Type R since last December and it gets better and better. The engine seems to have finished freeing up now which took the best part of 12K. Once you get used to driving an i-VTEC engined car it is probably one of the most unique motoring experiences out there. If you keep it in the zone it becomes an absolute animal that will comfortably mix it up with cars costing several times its value.

I would recommend getting a full geometry set up on any new CTR as mine was badly out and this made it very tail happy. After set up it is now as neutral as a FWD car can ever be. You can simply hurl it into corners at crazy speeds with confidence as to what it will do, very reminisant of the old 1.6 (not 1.9) Pug GTi. I am adamant that some of the not too enthusiastic journalist comments regarding steering on the CTR in EVO Mag etc. are down to poorly set up cars. I even had mine from the factory with incorrect wheel balancing on the NSF and made a formal complaint to Honda about the poor pre delivery inspection which resulted in the free full geometry set up and some goodies .

Fuel consumption is no where near as bad as a Scoob. You will easily return 25Mpg even when in spending most time in the VTEC zone.

It is a very very good car and anyone wanting a practical (big boot) car with one of the best engine, transmission and chassis available today should look no further.

Mine will be sadly up for sale next month as the miles are going to increasing so if anyone wants a Silver 51 Reg. CTR then i will take offers of circa. £13,000.

Magic Boot

30Mpg in a Scoob with a heavy right foot???? LOL I've owned 2 Scoobs UK & STI V and i'd have loved to have seen better than 18Mpg when enjoying one's self. :P

The Type R IS more frugal than any Scoob PERIOD!

Thanks for your constructive imput by the way.

DJDunk, you have mail.

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Well i did get it down to 3/4 of a tank from full when playing with a Porsche 911 but that was over 50 miles on the cough Autobahn cough but speeds were quite high then.
Normal 90-100mph i can get just under 30mpg, my car does have a better ecu than the standard one thou (its a PPP) and i do only run Optimax/SUL) so i benefit there too.
The first long distance drive i did down to my mates in Winchester when i first got the car (was running it in) was more nearer the 400mile mark (and needed to keep changing the revs as not to sit at a constant for too long ) but since then ive only ever seen it near that once and that was during the fuel crisis
But with MIXED driving and trust me i do open my car up a near 30mpg is acheivable

Tony

Dan B

I think I've got bored with my scoob and have been looking around for a new car around the 15K mark.

I took one for a 60 mins test drive yesturday, and I'm not being the Stereo typical cynical scooby driver, but I was not impressed. I had high hopes going into the garage, but when I got there I seemed to know more about the car than the salesman did!

Anyway, worked out that IMHO the car is a compromise. It is a compromise between a car that you can nicely cruise around below 3K revs, and a car with a bit of poke. When I opened it up I wasn't expecting warp speed, but I was expecting something. something didn't happen until about 6,500 when the VTEC kicked in, and that something stopped 1750 revs later when we bounced of the rev limited at 8250. I found it very hard work to keep the car up there, and I would want the car mainly for the performance. I would not be happy constantly thrashing the nuts of it, even if the "engine was designed for it." I did a few standing starts. One we just sat there with the wheels spinning (sidesteped the clutch at 6500) until I put it in 2nd.

I found the handling good, took it down some B roads, but at first was very ginger with it (because it wasn't my car) Got told to "thrash the nuts of it" by the salesperson, so let go a bit. The difference between awd and fwd became a bit shocking, I didn't feel safe. However, the car went where I pointed it, and I got used to the close ratio gearing and keeping the revs up after about 20mins.
The ride is fairly hard, which is where the handling comes from I suppose, but the back end did like to twitch. I suppose this comes from the fact that I'm used to the sccob, I didn't feel confident enough to hammer through corners.

By the end of the session I was tempted, it has some performance when you want it, the running costs were alot less than the scoob, and it looks gooooood, especially in black.

It will be at the back of my mind to have, but it was not a good a car as I thought it was going to be.

I'm going to go to the MG garage to see what their babies are like, but I'm not going to make a desecion until the RS Focus has been abused.

At the end of the day I was more happy to keep my scoob (esp because the stupid git salesman offered me £3500 p/x ex for the car, 93WRX) than to have the type-r.

Gastro

..they also can use *alot* of oil.. Beware - several warranty claims for blown engines due to excessive oil usage

Gastro

The_Gza

I also took one for a test drive last night. I was really hoping to be impressed by the CTR, but I have to agree with Dan's comments above. You really have to be trashing it all the time in order to get it to go, which is fine for those who like to drive it like this, but personally I simply would get fed up trashing it senseless all the time. Bit disappointed really, as I really wanted to like the car but I think I'll be giving it a miss.

I can see how people can and do like it, but it just wasn't for me. Perhaps I'll go and test drive a nice Toyota Camry or something now

Magic Boot

It is interesting to hear other peoples views regarding the CTR and even more interesting that the same points keep cropping up. After driving a Subaru Impreza which relies heavily on it's torque at modest revs., the CTR does feel very strange at first. Having owned a UK car followed by an STI V i too felt very uneasy on my first test drive. I had already ordered my CTR at this time so you can imagine my concerns thinking i had made a grave mistake. However, after a few weeks of ownership learning the Type R's character it all falls into place. It is no longer a chore to keep the engine boiling and i can honestly say that you get more satisfaction stringing a set of B road twisties together in the CTR than i did in the understeering or snap oversteer Scoobs. The CTR is more fluid on the limit.

Cars often force bad workmen to blame their tools. Lets face it all cars require drivers to adapt and some take more time than others. Also the driver has to have the potential to adapt in the first place!

With regard to the oil consumption, all VTEC, i-VTEC engines use a little more oil than a coventional engine. This is common knowledge and any dealer, specialist will tell you same. It was disturbing on the CTR during the first 10,000 miles as it felt like I was always topping up. It now hardly uses a drop at 15K. It is important that the level is at Max though as it is oil pressure that changes over the cam profile at VTEC changeover point.

Gastro

.....so people keep telling me - but to be honest I've had 2 ITR's now - and neither used a drop between services.......!
Somehow Honda have played the high performance, use more oil card for long enough --> some people on the Honda forum were topping up 1l every 500-1000 miles - a little excessive ! In your case it looks like things have bedded in & evened out.
Otherwise I think they are good cars just highlighting a known characteristic....

Gastro

Magic Boot

Just read the bit about blown engines. Is this really of Scooby epademic proportions? ..... I don't think so! I only know of 1 engine that has suffered problems from reading all UK Honda/Type R BBS.

father_jack

The Civic has strong power all the way from 3,000rpm to the limiter at 8,500 - dunno what people are complaining about.
It should just have a rev counter that doesn't start till 3,000rpm just like my old RGV250 then all would be well.
Handlings not quite as good as the other Type Rs as they skimped on the LSD (of the mechanical kind )

pisshead

Love mine to bits.. They look a hell of a lot more special on the rad than what they do in the pics, and talk about turning heads etc.

SJobson

Hmmm, I didn't find my MY99 Scoob to have much go below 3000rpm (less than the Honda, and with abysmal throttle response because of the turbo lag), so my preference is definitely for the normally aspirated engine.

I tried the Honda because it caused so much debate on various forums. And I went back 3 times because I liked it, eventually taking delivery on 1 March. Now done 7200 miles and I'm growing fonder of it all the time. It's quieter on the m-way than an old shape Scoob, but when you want to, it picks up its skirts and plays. Great Jekyll and Hyde sort of car, IMO.

[Edited by SJobson - 9/13/2002 2:04:04 PM]

bumcrack

Well I raced one up the M621 and it was neck and neck from 0-140(kph) up hill. I did have to start behind him at the lights, which didn't help. A gap of a about 20m with me closing up at about 110. I was well shocked. If we'd had been side by side at the lights it would have been a different tale.
Fast enough for the money, I don't like the look of them and am going for the S2000 instead.

[Edited by bumcrack - 9/14/2002 11:42:44 AM]

mrp

What sort of fuel consumption do you get out of the CTR? Possible house move will force the sale of my scoob but still want something quick but frugal. Thinking of Golf GT TDI 130 (sensible option) or a CTR (fun option). Had a CRX many years ago and loved it.

Martin

lpitt

If you read the whole of this post, I answered this in detail on page 1!!!

Laurence

bumcrack

OOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHH!

mrp

Yes Laurence I did read page 1 and very informative it was too!!!!!

What I was trying to find out was a few responses from CTR owners to see if your experiance with mpg is a one off or is it typical of what you can expect with average driving conditions. My journey will be mostly motorway and A roads. Just trying to guage how much worse a CTR would be over a 130pd (by the way did the change make much difference to your insurance premium over the scooby?)



Martin

lpitt

Sorry. I had just arrived in Utah when I typed that and was a bit travel-lagged!

Have a look at Honda-R on the topic of consumption. What you will find is that although it depends on how you drive it, the consumption is AT WORST the same as a Scooby (ie around 25mpg). Normal driving though (and my drive to work is 20 miles of motorway then 25 miles of 'B' roads) gives me 32-34 constantly.

Insurance wise. (5 years NCB, 20k miles, Class 1 Business, 2 named drivers, garaged)

MY98 Impreza. 17" Speedlines, Eibach springs, Turbo-timer and gauges, £1000 ICE cover, HKS SPF Induction, full de-cat, CAT 1 alarm, Tracker). Cost £940 in July 2001.

MY01 CTR. BMC Carbon Dynamic Induction, Magnex Catback exhaust, £1000 ICE cover, CAT 1 alarm, Tracker). Cost £519 in July 2002.

Admittedly with a different insurer, but my renewal from the original insurer was £697.

Does that help?

Laurence
PS (Flame on): The CTR is tons more fun to drive than a PD130!)

[Edited by lpitt - 9/15/2002 4:21:15 PM]

mrp

No worries Laurence

Thanks for the info, it's just what I was after. Hoping to sell the idea to my wife that the CTR will be a good bit cheaper to run than the scooby in terms of petrol and insurance (just spent £600 on a 90k service!). I think my next step is to book a test drive with a local Honda dealer and see what I think of it in the metal.

thanks again for the info

Martin

Magic Boot

Check the FOR SALE Section.

DJ Dunk

iTrader: (5)

Magic Boot - Can you please mail me as you have no email address quoted

[Edited by DJ Dunk - 9/12/2002 10:19:53 AM]

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Magic,
so it returns about the same MPG as a scoob (and a slightly modified one at that then?)
I have a tendancy to get nearer the 30mpg mark but that includes quite alot of time in the turbo zone so that actually makes a Type R quite thirsty over the older vtec units?

Tony
(ps i still think that the 306 GTi-6 rules )

[Edited by TonyBurns - 9/12/2002 10:18:16 AM]

lpitt

No, the MPG is nowhere near the Scooby.

Best I could manage in my Scooby (de-cat, induction) was around 28mpg on a run. Real driving returned around 22mpg.

I've now got the CTR (catback, induction) and the WORST I've had was 26mpg, average is around 32mpg and on a decent run I get around 38-40mpg.

But anyway, sorry about that 'cos really who cares. If we were worried about mpg then we would all drive diesel cars wouldn't we ?

Here's how I reckon you decide between the two:

Take a well driven CTR and a well driven Scooby on a normal run of 'A', 'B' and twisties over about 50 miles. (Both standard for arguments sake). In the dry it will be close, in the wet the Scooby gets it.

Take a normally driven CTR and a normally driven Scooby (I'm sure that most of us rate 'normal' or we'd be called Burns or Mcrae) on a normal run of 'A', 'B' and twisties over about 50 miles. (Both standard for arguments sake). Wet or dry the Scooby will win (although not massively )

Bottom line is that the Scooby is an confidence inspiring drive that makes just about anyone into a fantastic driver. The CTR whilst good takes a bit more mastering first.

I don't regret changing one bit. My only regret is that since I changed I haven't been able to get to a track-day

Laurence


[Edited by lpitt - 9/12/2002 10:46:29 AM]