Originally Posted by bludgod
(Post 11697385)
that's class value for a brand spanking new one! If you had a 2.5 I'd be worried about surge but not on the 2.0. As you say it's like an old dawes device totally blocks it but then when you get going the ECU can taper and control it. Might only be worth 200rpm but why not have all you can have? My classic one I chopped the loom off and used spade connectors :D
I thought a smaller engine would Be more prone to surge? Simply because the engine cannot consume the air supplied. I will make a short loom and take it with me, along with some pipe, that way I can run either, see wht the man says on the day. Anyone had bother with fuel pump controller not working after being unplugged?? |
Originally Posted by boosted
(Post 11697367)
I suppose the other way of looking at it is a tiny amount of wastegate creep as the turbo comes in boost will help towards combating any compressor surge by keeping the wheel speed down below the surge limit?
I'm all for using a 3 port, but at the moment my 20g is making 1.3 bar by 3500 on the two port. I will double check this on the way home, but it's certainly not too laggy. No sign of any surge either? But what boost do you see at 3000 ? I must not convinced that without the 3 port that you can control as well at the bottom range , and as many on here claim a 20G is laggy , it would interest me if you could get a even better mapped effect on the 3 port than I did when I just tuned the WG actuator in an attempt to compensate the 2 ports failings. Whatever , Now that I have the my Pistons/ACL bottom end in. :norty: I m keen to see the boost torque curve once your done , Im a bit worried about noticing extra lag from going up a turbo size or two to 18G/20G on mine. Personally Id trade across the band 20-25 bhp at max for same torque but to achieve it 400-500 rpm lower. |
Originally Posted by boosted
(Post 11697399)
I always think outside the box!
I thought a smaller engine would be more prone to surge? Simply because the engine cannot consume the air supplied. Aye but with a smaller engine you get less exhaust gasses to spin it up to/past the surge line as well. Also at the higher RPM's when some of the wastegate springs start to open you can keep the power on a little longer with a 3port where the 2port even at 95% duty just can't do it. As you say though it's an easy swap so fire on with the 2port and if your not getting the results you want a few minutes will have it switched out. Get the dyno graphs up when your done! |
Originally Posted by bludgod
(Post 11697417)
Aye but with a smaller engine you get less exhaust gasses to spin it up to/past the surge line as well. Also at the higher RPM's when some of the wastegate springs start to open you can keep the power on a little longer with a 3port where the 2port even at 95% duty just can't do it.
As you say though it's an easy swap so fire on with the 2port and if your not getting the results you want a few minutes will have it switched out. Get the dyno graphs up when your done! Not sure I will get dyno graphs as it's all mapped on the road. |
Originally Posted by Linksfahrer
(Post 11697409)
Umm 3500 , ok / perhaps most consider that normal for 20G ?
But what boost do you see at 3000 ? I must not convinced that without the 3 port that you can control as well at the bottom range , and as many on here claim a 20G is laggy , it would interest me if you could get a even better mapped effect on the 3 port than I did when I just tuned the WG actuator in an attempt to compensate the 2 ports failings. Whatever , Now that I have the my Pistons/ACL bottom end in. :norty: I m keen to see the boost torque curve once your done , Im a bit worried about noticing extra lag from going up a turbo size or two to 18G/20G on mine. Personally Id trade across the band 20-25 bhp at max for same torque but to achieve it 400-500 rpm lower. My 16g made 1.5 bar by 3200, but won't hold that past 5000 rpm, boost starts to drop considerably after 5k. |
you can still get a virtual dyno printout, won't be balls on accurate but will give you an idea beyond what the butt dyno confirms.
I found the same with the 16g btw, except I can push on past 5000rpm with the 3port, but with my STI pinks I need to reign it back a bit :( |
Originally Posted by bludgod
(Post 11697425)
you can still get a virtual dyno printout, won't be balls on accurate but will give you an idea beyond what the butt dyno confirms.
I found the same with the 16g btw, except I can push on past 5000rpm with the 3port, but with my STI pinks I need to reign it back a bit :( What AFR are you aiming for with your 95 Ron petrol? |
hey - that's 98 octane rat piss you, none of your 95 malarky! Currently sitting around 11.20 and the EGT's seem happy so might go a bit leaner still just to squeeze a little more PSI from the snail.
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Originally Posted by bludgod
(Post 11697458)
hey - that's 98 octane rat piss you, none of your 95 malarky! Currently sitting around 11.20 and the EGT's seem happy so might go a bit leaner still just to squeeze a little more PSI from the snail.
I'm actually thinking a 16g might be a better turbo. Hmmm, have to make my mind up! |
swap to 98? no no mr it's just 98 octane super unleaded from the pump. Are you thinking of e85?
The 16g has been good to me, but the 20g just seems to be more of everything with only a little less spoolup to get going. An 18g could be a middle ground compromise but you'll always be wondering what more the 20g could give you up top. |
Originally Posted by bludgod
(Post 11697468)
swap to 98? no no mr it's just 98 octane super unleaded from the pump. Are you thinking of e85?
The 16g has been good to me, but the 20g just seems to be more of everything with only a little less spoolup to get going. An 18g could be a middle ground compromise but you'll always be wondering what more the 20g could give you up top. Aye I'll go with the 20g, bigger is always better! |
hah - yeh except when it comes to knock count :D - fergie tractor indeed, my exhaust isn't that big!
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Good banter 👍
I've ordered the 3 port, also ordered a gallon of 10-50 from opie and some ngk 7's. |
Ok so I have .5 bar by 2800, 1.0 bar by 3500 and 1.3 bar by 3600 ish
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Stinking rich as it comes on full boost, leans off to 11.5:1 as it revs out at 1.2 bar. I'd imagine that's these injectors maxed out at 1.2 bar. Also the timing will be retarded to hell on boost i would imagine.
It's flowing above what it's mapped for so the injectors will be 100% and timing dead retarded for safety. |
1 Attachment(s)
Originally Posted by boosted
(Post 11697552)
Stinking rich as it comes on full boost, leans off to 11.5:1 as it revs out at 1.2 bar. I'd imagine that's these injectors maxed out at 1.2 bar. Also the timing will be retarded to hell on boost i would imagine.
It's flowing above what it's mapped for so the injectors will be 100% and timing dead retarded for safety. Without plenty of DC head room you will have to be careful of not overheating No 3 . In top/above 6-6500rpm Id be thinking to start tapering that down a touch , but presumably you don't fly around at >140 mph like I am inclined to do over here. |
Originally Posted by Linksfahrer
(Post 11697715)
Ok Just do the FPR cheat and gain yourself that little bit of head room. (attached) you will like this because it won#t cost you a penny, but it may be enough to keep your engine at full boost even for a touch longer , but 1.3 bar on a 20g is already hefty amount of flow.
Without plenty of DC head room you will have to be careful of not overheating No 3 . In top/above 6-6500rpm Id be thinking to start tapering that down a touch , but presumably you don't fly around at >140 mph like I am inclined to do over here. I'm running 1.2 bar up the revs, but not making any good power as the timing is very retarded. I don't drive fast very often at all. |
Originally Posted by boosted
(Post 11697772)
This is on my 440 cc injectors, I'll not be touching the car until the night before remap, when it will get the bigger injectors.
I'm running 1.2 bar up the revs, but not making any good power as the timing is very retarded. I don't drive fast very often at all. |
Cool, I did contemplate fitting the injectors down there, only takes 20 minutes. I'll see how I feel nearer the time
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Originally Posted by boosted
(Post 11697821)
Cool, I did contemplate fitting the injectors down there, only takes 20 minutes. I'll see how I feel nearer the time
Scoobynet contributor after a single "burn up the motorway" :wonder::wonder::wonder: |
Originally Posted by Linksfahrer
(Post 11697841)
Id say its more likely to take you a little longer , but I'm left handed so who knows , do be careful :poke: that they are seated well under the rails as they bend a bit when you torque everything back up, especially once if you have been cheating the FPR , Id hate us to loose a good
Scoobynet contributor after a single "burn up the motorway" :wonder::wonder::wonder: The longest wait is letting the engine cool down as you say... Oh might be buying another turbo, Andy says my Chinese 20g is a gamble and could make anything between 330-400 hp, I don't particularly want that risk for the money and time that is now involved! Spend hundreds the last few weeks, and I've not even got it mapped yet! Look at something like a big 16g or an 18g. |
i'd say 18g then if your looking at proper snails, the 16g will leave you wanting more as mine has
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Originally Posted by bludgod
(Post 11697883)
i'd say 18g then if your looking at proper snails, the 16g will leave you wanting more as mine has
The biggest restriction I have is my std manifolds, I don't want to change them (to cracky, laggy tubular ones) so an 18g will probably get the best out of my set up, 360+ hp. That's why I've bought something different lol 😂 |
What you really want is a bigger engine.
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Originally Posted by ScottyPPP
(Post 11698148)
What you really want is a bigger engine.
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Unlimited, I like that, sounds way cooler :cool:
You've never had a lump bigger than 3.0? |
Originally Posted by ScottyPPP
(Post 11698207)
Unlimited, I like that, sounds way cooler :cool:
You've never had a lump bigger than 3.0? My golf was 440bhp and ran 12.5's. My good mate has a 4.0 32v V8 in a supra with a GT4088 on it, aiming for 600hp this year. Tuning it on the road is interesting! Unlimited, not so cool if your running against a Nissan gtr that does 11's! You will be wishing you had 100cc less and racing me instead. |
Mine has never seen a Drag strip as it is so I think you'll be safe ;). I think it would be pretty handy at it though. I'd need more than 100cc less, mine is 2124cc.
Supra sounds interesting. |
Originally Posted by ScottyPPP
(Post 11698237)
Mine has never seen a Drag strip as it is so I think you'll be safe ;). I think it would be pretty handy at it though. I'd need more than 100cc less, mine is 2124cc.
Supra sounds interesting. Supra is useless! All that power and no grip! |
New (old second hand) turbo ordered.
Genuine mitsubishi "big" TD05 16g. From an evo3. Should fit straight into my exhaust housing, compressor cover needs a little work but nothing major. Good for 360-380hp apparently. See what if looks like when it arrives. |
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