DavidBrown

The old "yeah, but a decent driver in a sh1te car, can beat a crap driver in a great car" argument..

But lets not forget that, a good driver in a P1 will be even faster, and if you're a crap driver, then why not go for the faster car to compensate for your lack of skill ?

[Edited by DavidBrown - 7/3/2002 9:31:45 AM]

Neil Smalley

Because a crap driver in a fast car is a potentially lethal combination.

A lot of poor and average drivers do buy faster cars to flatter their own ability, and it often ends in tears.

This is one of the reasons why I think that more emphasis on giving insurance discounts for people who have taken the time to take and pass advanced driving tests. At the moment very few companies will give a meaningful discount and so anyone who's age and location profile can insure a fast car.

The schemes run by TVR and Ferrari where they will only sell you a car if you are able to drive it safely are ideal. With P1's,STI's and EVO's offering the same league point to point speed as a ferrari then it would seem a sensble policy for Subaru,BMW, Mitsbishi to make.

[Edited by Neil Smalley - 7/3/2002 9:47:25 AM]

Rottie1

This isnt a knock or anything just confused.

As i have just bought my first scoob and am chuffed to bits i got to thinking why is the p1 so much quicker.

My point is in an EVO mag i have, they test 4 different scoobs to see which is the best EVO car.

One quote is ( talking of irresponsable, i have just nailed the p1 and seem to be accelerating at an alarming rate).

Yet difference from 0-100mph is 0.8secs quicker than an RB5.

Also when i looked at a scoob and rang the previous owner (nice chap) he said that he sold it for a p1 and there is a massive difference in performance.

I would love a p1 (one day) so whats the deal with the performance.

Cheers

Rottie

Neil Smalley

The car is only as quick as the driver wants it to be, either by hammering it to within an RPM of it's life or by their ability.

After about 90Mph the P1 will have the legs of a PPP'd car(including an RB5(with PPP)) up until then there's not much in it. If anything for the 1st 30 feet the PPP car will have the edge as it's torque comes in earlier.

In real life 0.8 seconds difference is zip. If you are 2 seconds behind the car in front, then it'll only get you half way closer before you are matching speeds. If you are only 1 second behind you'll be beside his rear wheel arch before you match speeds.

Many Prodrive'd (PPP) cars have had the legs of a P1 on the track so many times i've lost count. The biggest difference, was the driver. For example Puff and Doc Jock can outrun a lot more powerful cars just because they know how to get the most out of their cars.

Rottie1

Cheers for that,

i suppose its the whole package, I have never come near to my car limits yet ( got overtaken by a Tigra on my first weekend!!) with new car.

P1 there just so bloody expensive but bloody nice.

Rottie

marty

Auto car test the 0-100 of the RB5 as 13.9secs. with the performance pack.They tested the P1 at 12.2secs.I have a P1 and up to about 80 there is not that much between them,but i cant believe how fast I pull away after this.
marty

EvilBevel

>>They tested the P1 at 12.2secs

Will not happen. 13.2 maybe.

johnfelstead

Try an STi5 TypeR for size.

Basically the same as a P1 but without all the good stuff taken away!

I always laugh at these write ups when they say it accelerates like crazy. No it doesnt, Scoobs arent that fast in the big scheme of things. They are very capable cars though.

pslewis

Well my bog standard Wagon will keep up with any P1

Its the driver that counts and, at 73 I have all the experience of Robin Burns TIMES three!!! so there!!

Also I am so close to death anyway I can take corners quicker than you - as I dont care!!

Pete

dhorwich

"Scoobs arent that fast in the big scheme of things"

Do sti 5's do 0-60 in about 5 secs how many other cars at 2000cc do that 0-60 i would say they are fast especially in the big scheme of things i.e other 'ROAD' cars.....

Anyone make a list of road going production cars that do 0-60 in less than 5 secs..... that are practical and have a engine capacity of 2000cc...!

just my 2p worth...

Dan

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

Dan, I think John is coming from the 'mentally fast' Westie point of view. I'd have to agree. If you have been in one of these or Mike R's Cossie then you'll know what really fast is.

I know that driver skill plays a big part in it, but get behind the wheel of one of those cars and most people will be superfast - anytime, anywhere...

F

P1Fanatic

A westie is a motorbike with 4 wheels in all essence. In terms of affordability, practicality etc a standard turbo is more than fast enough for day to driving. Of course there are cars that are going to be faster - that could be said all the way up to top fuel dragsters, and land speed record cars.

Eagle7

i agree, plus its damn hard to park a dragster at sainsbury's!

johnfelstead

my last ROAD car did 0-60 in 3.2 seconds, got to 100 in 7.5 and hit 155MPH in 17.5 seconds. 100% road legal, I did about 7500 miles a year in that.

I agree though that a scoob is damn hard to beat as an allrounder, which is why i run one everyday. The point i was making was that there is an awefull lot of crap written by motoring journalists, half of them have never driven a fast car. D

CraigH

0-60 is a pretty meaningless performance measure - apart from when it comes to bragging of course

60-100 is far more indicative - look at 01/02 WRXs - 0-60 not bad, but 60-100 similar to Clio 172, Octavia RS, Leon Cupra etc - and SLOWER than things like Fiat Coupe 20vs and Nissan 200sx's.

If you look at the 0-60 times though you'd think different.

If you look at an RB5 with PPP, its probably got a real 240-250hp and 250lb ft and a P1 as std will have about 265-270hp and maybe 260lb ft - 20hp in a 1300kg car doesn't make much difference

ian_sadler

0-60 is by far the most usfull info for me when looking a buying a car cos you get half a chance to use it day to day.

60-100 not round here

Ian

shunty

craigh - I totally agree with your last comment, although we do all quote the 0-60 figure sometimes (although never quoted until someone asks for it, or you is a *** init)

I've said this before & will say it again for all the PC crew
if you say that you don't ever drive a scooby fast, then why buy one....for the build quality & space
right time - right place - right conditions....sums it up nicely I think.

shunty

Pooder

Never understood all this stuff about the PI --I owned a MY98 for 4years and now own a STI type uk. The 98 was a little slower than a P1 and my current STI is much quicker in the real world and yes I have driven a P1 several times

P1Fanatic

Pooder - you obviously didnt get out of the supermarket car park which kind of hinders you in testing the difference. Anyone who can say a P1 is only a little bit faster than a standard MY98 was either in a poorly P1 or it wasnt being driven to the max.

Arron

THIS IS THE BIGGEST LOAD OF HORSE SH1TE i'VE HAVE HEARD.
WHO GIVES A RAT'S AR$E IF A P1 IS FASTER THAN A UK98 OR WHAT EVER, DOES IT REALY MATTER.
As Neil Smalley said a driver that knows his car and can get the best from it will out drive a person in a p1 / rb5 ppp or most things.
It all comes done to how much risk you are willing to take.

Why did I reply to this thread.

SpiderMan10

V4/5 Type R does 0-60 in around 4.3 secs.

Forget the P1. A lot of fuss about nothing. There is no deal with its performance. Just comes in sonic blue and look vaguely like a 22b. Type R/RA would eat it.

Save your money for the import. P1 the most over-rated car around.

People cream themselves when someone mentions P1. Why??? Much prefer a proper piece of sti hardware.

CraigH

Neil,

Thought most people bought Scoobs to flatter their own ability

Spiderman.

What bull. 4.3 vs 4.6 is not eating - 12.3ish 0-100 vs 13secs is not eating - assuming you can do those times in the Type R. And then it only does about 145 true mph thanks to the gearing - so the P1 would be pulling away at higher speeds.

Get a P1 and STI on track and the performance will be virtually identical.

babber

LOL at this thread!!! Some people are soooo biased Is the Evo mag from last year (August I think) and the RB5 WRSport ? If so then that's my car Oh and the RB5 WRSport is faster than everything mentioned in this thread , lol.

Well it's faster now, as I have removed the PPP ECU and fitted a TEK 3 - 0.15 (a special map from John Banks ) Can't wait to find a P1 on a private road now, lol

Cheers Phill C

[Edited by babber - 7/3/2002 1:32:32 PM]

[Edited by babber - 7/3/2002 2:14:55 PM]

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

Neil

If Subaru followed Ferrari/TVR then they probably wouldn't sell many cars as most owners on here are cr@p and couldn't pass the training (years of bad habits).

Why would Subaru narrow their market by doing this anyway, lets face it if they can sell a car to someone who will stuff it then they can make even more money repairing the car (the same goes for security, but they've been forced to make it a selling point now).

F
PS Phil C, I hope you're not going to 'bang' on about your new toy for ever in every thread that I read... It sound good though.

Neil Smalley

Floyd.

I know. It just disturbs me sometimes some of the stories that are on here(and other BBS's) about people driving beyond their abilities..

I know l'm a wussy/average driver so I took steps to ensure that i'm the best wussy/average driver I can be.

In a way it's a shame the wetter the better driving course finished. That was apparently very,very good at teaching car control.

chrisp

So lets see what people have said :

1. Mr Felstead had no problem keeping up with UK turbos in his sport (proved).

2. UK turbo in the real world can easily keep up with a WRSport version as it only 30bhp more at most (very possible).

3. A WRSport can easily keep up with a P1 (as there is only 20-25bhp more and a P1 is heavier)

4. Very little difference between a P1 and STI as the P1 started life as a STi5TR

5. P1 also quicker on a twisty road than an F355 as posted in a thread recently.


So what does it prove a 2.0 NA Sport will keep up an Evo7 and possibly blow away an F355 .

Something not quite right here .

Also I hope Phil that SUK arent reading this as they would have your reg and ECU upgrade down on paper for warranty purposes

ChrisP

johnfelstead

Mine has the best of both worlds, if thats the right terminology?

It has STi TypeR 1st to 4th then standard STi 5th so will top out with a P1 yet out acelerate it. Mine also has the quickrack which prodrive removed from the P1 for some bizarre reason? It has the centre diff control so puts more power to the wheels. It has a front LSD and plated rear LSD so grips better and can be adjusted by the driver to suit conditions/style. Has thicker driveshafts so is stronger. Has inverted struts for better unsprung weight. It has Intercooler sprays so doesnt suffer from as much charge temp heat soak. It's lighter, has a better dash with the rev counter where its required in the middle, has 2 pot rear brakes rather than sliding one pots. Has no ABS so brake feel is much better. Has better front seats being the SWRT limited edition jobbies.

The P1 is a great car, no way is it the ultimate production Impreza! Half of the good stuff was removed!

Dave_UK300

Thats STi sounds cool

babber

Floyd,

Yes sorry mate am well happy

Chrisp,

Good point, but not too bothered the warranty runs out in three months and will be my responsibility from there on.

Cheers Phill C

chrisp

Phil yep I agree I hardly changed my UK (just a bb) due to warranty issues wished I had of done now but my RA has been played with a little bit more nothing too serious, but they have already been played with at the factory . Must say I am jealous of JF's 5th ratio as it could do with 22-23mph /1000 as mine is perhaps a bit more on the manic side but the roll on push is awesome plus i keep going for 6th LOL. Get me ready for an MY03 400bhp RA V-LTD though