BHP per tonne same question different BBS
10 July 2001 | 03:07 PM
#1
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Just wondered what you lot had...
To make comparisons with thats all.
RS500 - 1240kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Saphire 2WD 1250kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Saphire 4WD 1290kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Escort Cosworth T3 1275kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Escort Cosworth T25 1275kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Impreza 22B 1270kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Mine is 1050KG fully loaded.
Average Person is 80kg.
Fuel is dunno, say 10 gallons (my tank was full). (estimated 40kg)
So full Loaded i have <B>384</B> BHP per tonne.
Just wondered what the scoob's produced
To make comparisons with thats all.
RS500 - 1240kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Saphire 2WD 1250kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Saphire 4WD 1290kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Escort Cosworth T3 1275kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Escort Cosworth T25 1275kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Impreza 22B 1270kg - No ICE, fuel or Driver.
Mine is 1050KG fully loaded.
Average Person is 80kg.
Fuel is dunno, say 10 gallons (my tank was full). (estimated 40kg)
So full Loaded i have <B>384</B> BHP per tonne.
Just wondered what the scoob's produced
10 July 2001 | 03:53 PM
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My Exige is 340BHP / Tonne
PLUS ! It has shedloads of downforce (35Kg at the front and 45Kg at the rear at 100mph) so it can go round corners fast when your 70's throw-back is creeping round them.. (assuming equal driving ability)
Power is nothing, without control.
(All in good jest)
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).]
PLUS ! It has shedloads of downforce (35Kg at the front and 45Kg at the rear at 100mph) so it can go round corners fast when your 70's throw-back is creeping round them.. (assuming equal driving ability)
Power is nothing, without control.
(All in good jest)
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).]
10 July 2001 | 04:03 PM
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stef,
Funny how many times you have been off isn't it.
I have brakes coming so i will be faster...(hopefully)
ooo and how many times have you crashed in the last couple of months
As for Lotus's....mmmmm
Every time they are at donno they come off the track on more than one occasion....
Need to be de tunned some more, but that Rover engine is Shat in any case......340, why the **** is it so slow in a straight line then......impressive figure but not so impressive in reality.
they do look pukka tho
[This message has been edited by dingy (edited 10 July 2001).]
Funny how many times you have been off isn't it.
I have brakes coming so i will be faster...(hopefully)
ooo and how many times have you crashed in the last couple of months
As for Lotus's....mmmmm
Every time they are at donno they come off the track on more than one occasion....
Need to be de tunned some more, but that Rover engine is Shat in any case......340, why the **** is it so slow in a straight line then......impressive figure but not so impressive in reality.
they do look pukka tho
[This message has been edited by dingy (edited 10 July 2001).]
10 July 2001 | 04:11 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by dingy:
<B>Every time they are at donno they come off the track on more than one occasion....
[/quote]
Not me.. in fact, last time I saw you out on the track (at Oulton IIRC) the session had to be stopped while you retrieved your exhaust which fell off..
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR><B>340, why the **** is it so slow in a straight line then[/quote]
Probably because you've not been against a 340/Tonne Exige before.. but only a 220/Tonne Exige.. And last time at Donington, the other Exiges on the track were decidedly slower than me.. so perhaps your comparisons are of them, not me
It's a shame we've not been on the same bit of track together.
Straight line speed isn't everything, most race tracks I've used tend to have "corners" that facilitate a circuitous route around the track.
DocJock + Harj will testify that I wasn't hanging about, and that was in the slower 220/Tonne car..
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).]
<B>Every time they are at donno they come off the track on more than one occasion....
[/quote]
Not me.. in fact, last time I saw you out on the track (at Oulton IIRC) the session had to be stopped while you retrieved your exhaust which fell off..
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR><B>340, why the **** is it so slow in a straight line then[/quote]
Probably because you've not been against a 340/Tonne Exige before.. but only a 220/Tonne Exige.. And last time at Donington, the other Exiges on the track were decidedly slower than me.. so perhaps your comparisons are of them, not me
It's a shame we've not been on the same bit of track together.
Straight line speed isn't everything, most race tracks I've used tend to have "corners" that facilitate a circuitous route around the track.
DocJock + Harj will testify that I wasn't hanging about, and that was in the slower 220/Tonne car..
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).]
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10 July 2001 | 04:16 PM
#8
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David, exhaust bracket broke, not down to driver error tho was it so not a fair comparison.
As for the Exige's i was so disapointed with the performance but maybe you can put me in my place...
PS Harj is used to driving the 22B which has about as much pull as a Mini 850...
Wish mine had the brakes tho, soon..
As for the Exige's i was so disapointed with the performance but maybe you can put me in my place...
PS Harj is used to driving the 22B which has about as much pull as a Mini 850...
Wish mine had the brakes tho, soon..
10 July 2001 | 04:18 PM
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Ho Hum.... 
With 384bhp/tonne you should be annhialating everything on the track, but you're not, so to you!
Besides, your car isn't a Cossie so is of no concern to me.
Stef.
[This message has been edited by Stef (edited 10 July 2001).]
With 384bhp/tonne you should be annhialating everything on the track, but you're not, so
to you! Besides, your car isn't a Cossie so is of no concern to me.
Stef.
[This message has been edited by Stef (edited 10 July 2001).]
10 July 2001 | 04:23 PM
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Stef, don't be so sad, if i thought you were a good driver i would let you have a go in my car. (not having a POP either)
Returning the favour i think you would be slower in mine than i in yours....
As you wouldn't be able to drive it...
Scoobs practically drive them selfs....Power steering, ABS...i wish i had such modern equipement..
Returning the favour i think you would be slower in mine than i in yours....
As you wouldn't be able to drive it...
Scoobs practically drive them selfs....Power steering, ABS...i wish i had such modern equipement..
10 July 2001 | 04:24 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Stef:
<B>Ho Hum....
With 340bhp/tonne you should be annhialating everything on the track, but you're not, so to you! [/quote]
That's cos the 340/Tonne upgraded car's not been out on the track yet so back at ya.
And if I recall correctly, no-one passed me at my last track day (pre-upgrade)
<B> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Dingy said:
David, exhaust bracket broke, not down to driver error tho was it so not a fair comparison.[/quote]
Was pullin' yer plonka mate
<B> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>As for the Exige's i was so disapointed with the performance but maybe you can put me in my place... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE></B>
*I* was disappointed at them too !! I overtook my mate Hitch (H7TCHP) in his Exige 2-3x per session (perhaps that's who you saw?)
I'm not out to put anyone in their place. I'm out to have fun, irrespective of who's faster/slower. Seems there are alot of mediallion-man "scalp" claimers out there who get kicks out of claiming they've beaten a car (not knowing if they were on a warmup/cool down lap). I'm above that.
My respect doesn't go to the fastest dude, it goes to the dude who takes care of himself and others, and comes home with a complete car having had a great day of fun.
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).]
<B>Ho Hum....
With 340bhp/tonne you should be annhialating everything on the track, but you're not, so
to you! [/quote]That's cos the 340/Tonne upgraded car's not been out on the track yet so
back at ya.And if I recall correctly, no-one passed me at my last track day (pre-upgrade)
<B> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Dingy said:
David, exhaust bracket broke, not down to driver error tho was it so not a fair comparison.[/quote]
Was pullin' yer plonka mate
<B> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>As for the Exige's i was so disapointed with the performance but maybe you can put me in my place... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE></B>
*I* was disappointed at them too !! I overtook my mate Hitch (H7TCHP) in his Exige 2-3x per session (perhaps that's who you saw?)
I'm not out to put anyone in their place. I'm out to have fun, irrespective of who's faster/slower. Seems there are alot of mediallion-man "scalp" claimers out there who get kicks out of claiming they've beaten a car (not knowing if they were on a warmup/cool down lap). I'm above that.
My respect doesn't go to the fastest dude, it goes to the dude who takes care of himself and others, and comes home with a complete car having had a great day of fun.
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).]
10 July 2001 | 05:19 PM
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just a technical point...
david
(first of all, your car is almost certainly the most capable track car in this discussion and should be staggeringly quicker so I'm not dissing it!! )... but
340/tonne...
with all the downforce / drag, your power to weight will DRAMATICALLY drop off as the speed increases.
So whilst you are making it up in the corners, you are likely to have far less impressive performance at high speed.
Should still be able to eat almost anything alive though, apart from maybe R500's etc.
Dingy..
Your car is MKII escort... so I am DEFINITELY not dissing it... but...
I would eat harj's underpants if it's quicker than David's Exige round a track.
Cheers
Simon
david
(first of all, your car is almost certainly the most capable track car in this discussion and should be staggeringly quicker so I'm not dissing it!!
)... but340/tonne...
with all the downforce / drag, your power to weight will DRAMATICALLY drop off as the speed increases.
So whilst you are making it up in the corners, you are likely to have far less impressive performance at high speed.
Should still be able to eat almost anything alive though, apart from maybe R500's etc.
Dingy..
Your car is MKII escort... so I am DEFINITELY not dissing it... but...
I would eat harj's underpants if it's quicker than David's Exige round a track.
Cheers
Simon
10 July 2001 | 05:31 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Simon de Banke:
<B>340/tonne...
with all the downforce / drag, your power to weight will DRAMATICALLY drop off as the speed increases.[/quote]
More than the brick-wall aerodynamics of a Mk2 Escort ? Not challenging, just asking.
<B>340/tonne...
with all the downforce / drag, your power to weight will DRAMATICALLY drop off as the speed increases.[/quote]
More than the brick-wall aerodynamics of a Mk2 Escort ? Not challenging, just asking.
10 July 2001 | 05:38 PM
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dingy LOL!
david..
unlikely.. but the main differnce is the BHP per *tonne* as in weight..
downforce effectively increases dynamic weight. The drag is another factor.
I would say that something like a scoob would have dramatically less drag than your car at any speed... but there is no way I'm qualified to make that statement so it is just a gut feeling.
I wasn't bringing it up to say "your car would be slower than dingy's" (as you can see I said quite the oposite. Just thought it was an interesting technical point.
Cheers
Simon
david..
unlikely.. but the main differnce is the BHP per *tonne* as in weight..
downforce effectively increases dynamic weight. The drag is another factor.
I would say that something like a scoob would have dramatically less drag than your car at any speed... but there is no way I'm qualified to make that statement so it is just a gut feeling.
I wasn't bringing it up to say "your car would be slower than dingy's" (as you can see I said quite the oposite. Just thought it was an interesting technical point.
Cheers
Simon
10 July 2001 | 05:40 PM
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David.
I was talking to Dingy, not you ya muppet!
Oh, and I hope your 'medallion man' comments weren't aimed at me.
Admittedly, I do like to see how the Scoob compares to other more powerful cars though.
Stef.
I was talking to Dingy, not you ya muppet!
Oh, and I hope your 'medallion man' comments weren't aimed at me.
Admittedly, I do like to see how the Scoob compares to other more powerful cars though.
Stef.
10 July 2001 | 05:41 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Simon de Banke:
<B>I wasn't bringing it up to say "your car would be slower than dingy's[/quote]
No, it's OK. I got your gist.
However, I'd be prepared to nobble my car just to see you nosh into Harj's undercrackers (as it were)
<B>I wasn't bringing it up to say "your car would be slower than dingy's[/quote]
No, it's OK. I got your gist.
However, I'd be prepared to nobble my car just to see you nosh into Harj's undercrackers (as it were)
10 July 2001 | 05:43 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Stef:
<B>David.
I was talking to Dingy, not you ya muppet!.[/quote]
You've just edited it your posting from 340 (me) to 384 (Dingy).. ya double-muppet.. that's why I thought you meant me.
<B>David.
I was talking to Dingy, not you ya muppet!
.[/quote]You've just edited it your posting from 340 (me) to 384 (Dingy).. ya double-muppet.. that's why I thought you meant me.
10 July 2001 | 06:13 PM
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don't get me started on brakes!!! LOL
The exige would again kick the living crap out of a non downforce car in this area... especially if the fact (?? I think) that there is more downforce at the back has been taken advantage of in the brake bias..
It wouldn't allow huge rear brakes as it's still a road car, but I would be tempted to throw a few more percent to the rear.
If there is proper downforce happening there, it is quite likely that you could *just about* stand on the brakes at high speed and have a real job to lock the wheels up.. especially on slicks.
Obviously this all changes as the speed drops off, but the once the speed has dropped off, the power to weight comes back into play again.
Give it up dingy!!
Mind you.. (sorry david) I'd much rather throw the MKII around
The exige would again kick the living crap out of a non downforce car in this area... especially if the fact (?? I think) that there is more downforce at the back has been taken advantage of in the brake bias..
It wouldn't allow huge rear brakes as it's still a road car, but I would be tempted to throw a few more percent to the rear.
If there is proper downforce happening there, it is quite likely that you could *just about* stand on the brakes at high speed and have a real job to lock the wheels up.. especially on slicks.
Obviously this all changes as the speed drops off, but the once the speed has dropped off, the power to weight comes back into play again.
Give it up dingy!!
Mind you.. (sorry david) I'd much rather throw the MKII around
10 July 2001 | 06:43 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Simon de Banke:
<B>Mind you.. (sorry david) I'd much rather throw the MKII around[/quote]
Agreed.. I feel a 5th car coming on, for chucking about Having owned 3 Mk2's + 1 MK1, I've not lost the bug for them.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR><B>So what we're saying here, is basically, if David doesn't beat Dingy round track, he's a cr4p driver?[/quote]
That's more than likely ! I have no illusions about my current driving skills. But the thread was about the car.. not the driver !
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).]
<B>Mind you.. (sorry david) I'd much rather throw the MKII around
[/quote]Agreed.. I feel a 5th car coming on, for chucking about
Having owned 3 Mk2's + 1 MK1, I've not lost the bug for them.<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR><B>So what we're saying here, is basically, if David doesn't beat Dingy round track, he's a cr4p driver?[/quote]
That's more than likely ! I have no illusions about my current driving skills. But the thread was about the car.. not the driver !
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).]
10 July 2001 | 08:45 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by David Brown
DocJock + Harj will testify that I wasn't hanging about, and that was in the slower 220/Tonne car..
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).][/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Eh ?? ......never passed me all day...
Seriously, I was filming and David's Exige is the fastest motor on 1 1/2 hours worth.
DocJock + Harj will testify that I wasn't hanging about, and that was in the slower 220/Tonne car..
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).][/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Eh ?? ......never passed me all day...
Seriously, I was filming and David's Exige is the fastest motor on 1 1/2 hours worth.
10 July 2001 | 08:55 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>I have 475BHP/Tonne
that was the question wasnt it? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
No John
The question was <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Just wondered what the scoob's produced <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Richard
that was the question wasnt it? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
No John
The question was <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Just wondered what the scoob's produced <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Richard
10 July 2001 | 09:32 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by DocJock:
<B> Seriously, I was filming and David's Exige is the fastest motor on 1 1/2 hours worth.
[/quote]
Haven't you done that footage yet dammit ? (There's a free ride in the new Exige if you get it sorted !!)
John, naturally I'm going to ask the question.. what's it like for downforce / lateral G's etc ? - Dictating the speed you can carry through a bend (If I'm thinking right)
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).]
<B> Seriously, I was filming and David's Exige is the fastest motor on 1 1/2 hours worth.
[/quote]
Haven't you done that footage yet dammit ?
(There's a free ride in the new Exige if you get it sorted !!)John, naturally I'm going to ask the question.. what's it like for downforce / lateral G's etc ? - Dictating the speed you can carry through a bend (If I'm thinking right)
[This message has been edited by DavidBrown (edited 10 July 2001).]
11 July 2001 | 12:28 AM
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downforce, i dont have any of that david, i have lift as does 99% of other cars out there.
As to lateral G's, depends on how i decide to drive the corner. If i am dicking about then i have very little, but i will be wearing a silly grin from the process of melting my rears tyres. If i am going for speed through the corner then i probably have the same as you in the dry. My tyres work pretty well, better than the yoko's, not as good as a full slick though of course.
The question is however, can you exploit the available grip, i can get pretty close to the available.
As to lateral G's, depends on how i decide to drive the corner. If i am dicking about then i have very little, but i will be wearing a silly grin from the process of melting my rears tyres. If i am going for speed through the corner then i probably have the same as you in the dry. My tyres work pretty well, better than the yoko's, not as good as a full slick though of course.
The question is however, can you exploit the available grip, i can get pretty close to the available.