Gridlock Mikey

1400 miles across France,Belgium, Holland and Germany. On the Auto bahns did 120 mph plus ( Maximum stint was an indicated 150 mph for about 5 mins, playing with a M£ Scoobs really are crap at that speed ) for 2 - 3 hrs non stop, ITG, Decatted, no resonator, dawes, 98 ron plus octane booster, boost gauge, NO knock Link, NO afr, NO £500 remap and guess what............... THE CAR IS FINE and it has bugger all to do with being lucky and NO i have not damaged ny car and NO it's not about to blow up.

Just thought i'd mention it from the other side of the "highly" tuned fence. If you ain't faffin around with intercoolers, Turbo's or some other major component, Your car will be fine.

Trust me, I just done it

Hope you all had a merry Xmas and here's to a worry free new year

Mikey

Brun

Did you get a flame suit for Christmas?

andy oakes

Fair play to mikey..
Agreed mate!

Gridlock Mikey

lol @ brun I mean no offence to anyone, just wanted to point out that it is possible to enjoy ya car without worrying about it blowing up

Anyways, i'm off to Donno to check out that there sideways stuff

Mikey

astraboy

<On the Auto bahns did 120 mph plus ( Maximum stint was an indicated 150 mph for about 5 mins, playing with a M£ >
Geezer!
astraboy.

john banks

LOL

Brun

If it blows up, it blows up. It's a good excuse for a high BHP re-build IMO

john banks

Except that if you look after your engine you might not have to get it rebuilt.

Let me point out one thing Mikey - you fitted this to your car based on a group of Scoobynetter's research into several aspects of safety running this device on MY99/00 UK cars, which they shared for your benefit. Now you are suddenly an expert on the issue and feel you can ignore their conclusions on what monitoring is suitable when you don't know one end of an injector from another

[Edited by john banks - 12/29/2002 12:08:18 PM]

LG John

He's come back for more Me and you really should meet up as scoobynets most frequently flamed contributers

My scooby appeared to be sick yesterday and I got all paranoid. I drove a 100 mile return trip to see John Banks and to plug it into delta-dash to discover it was mainly a faulty boost gauge. Nevertheless, it was well worth it because I now have piece of mind that all is well and its set up correctly......I slept brilliantly last night

I'd rather just know that its all ok rather than hoping and guessing its all ok.

Glad you enjoyed your drive Can't have been cheap on the old fuel front

Gridlock Mikey

Morning John

Hope you and your folks had an excellent Xmas

Mikey

john banks

See my kind edit above Mikey Get a grip.

john banks

You are removing a major element of engine safety by taking away boost control from the ECU. That is fine if you know what it is boosting to (since the ECU is not controlling it for you) and that you know that the mixture is fine and/or it is not knocking.

Now imagine any of the following:

Overboost spike
Faulty MAF sensor
Blocked injector
Faulty fuel pump
Excessive coolant temperature

In all these circumstances the bloke running the standard ECU at least has a chance because the ECU can drop the boost if it $hits itself because of the detonation. The bloke running the Dawes if he has a boost gauge and AFR or knocklink can do the same. You sir can do none of these and are probably so mechanically insensitive you would not even hear the detonation and you would get a melt down.

Most people would treat the risk of a £3-5K meltdown seriously enough that when they remove a key safety device that can prevent this they at least replace it with a £30 boost gauge and £30 or whatever it is AFR meter.

Your defense of your engine not having blown up is ill-considered and naive.

I don't think I've got anything else to add.

Katana

You got lucky Mikey, especially if you kept the TMIC. At that speed your bonnet scoop would more than likely lose its efficiency as air would flow over the scoop, not into it.

astraboy

Sorry Katana, that is not the case. If any thing the air would stick closer to the bonnet as speed increased (called the boundary layer) simply because it is a smooth curved surface from the lip of the bonnet to the scoop. I wouldnt break away.
astraboy.

STi wanna Subaru

iTrader: (1)

but at those speed doesn't the bonnet start to lift and actually deflect air over the scoop. I'm sure as well that the oil temp and EGT will have been quite high.

john banks

The Scoop theory has been debated, but the most demanding situation for you intercooler is sustained 6000-7000 RPM at high boost on full load (ie top speed). Road car intercoolers work on the basis that they are not under continuous load, and if you track a turbo road car or run it at full speed at standard boost the intercooling is barely adequate. Turn up the boost on a small turbo with no ignition retard and you have an issue.

Even with a FMIC, at 6000+ RPM in 5th gear at high boost on a decent turbo with suitably retarded ignition and correct fuelling, I find that the sustained load means that I do need to back off timing more to stop it detting that I would with a blat through the gears...

I still think that detonation which is undetected is the main reason these engines blow up.

Subaru drop the top end boost below 10 PSI on the standard car for a reason. They also include a 144mph speed limiter (which gently rolls off the boost) for a reason. With a Dawes you have neither so if you are going to drive it at 150 mph at least have a knocklink.

[Edited by john banks - 12/29/2002 12:46:21 PM]

STi wanna Subaru

iTrader: (1)

I'll just convert Johns post into Mikey language......

Hope that helps mate

Brun

LMFAO

scooby_si

PMSL at the blah blah comment!
Still say each 2 their own but i fancy the more scientific approach
Si

Harry Potter

My 22B ran faultlessly for 29,000 miles.
98Ron with 1 tin of Proboost per 50L fill up (nb tank holds 60L but never let it run too low, apart from once! [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img] )

Several track days, high speed runs of 155 mph for 112miles until ran out of fuel on the run down to Catalunia

As always appologies to the rest of SIDC Catalunia club for forcing them to wait until Johno of Milton Keynes brought me some petrol!

The dual carriage was deserted we probably passed less than 5 tucks in that blast as it was 3.30am air temp arround 4-6 ^C

I did this is the knowledge that the car was well researched and reliable. So no boost guages, no knock sensor and no lambda sensor or EGT or oil temp/pressure

600 miles after my Powr Engineering rechip it went bang.

David power says "not my fault its a weak engine" [img]images/smilies/mad.gif[/img]

The car had run too hot hence melted valve stems and turbo seals.......now I have EGT sensor.

There was det now I have knock link.

The lambda link is there to reassure me with a big fat green one when I am on boost.

Oil temp and pressure is there for reassurance.

I can understand where John banks is coming from regarding safety issues, unlimmitted boost is a recipe for "potential" engine damage.

Its your car you take the risk.

Encouraging others to take risks could be risky

Harry Potter

BTW Astra boy my water comes out of the scoop over 100MPH -120MPH then starts to go back in So speed does effect the efficiency of the intercooler.

My EGT shoot up at 100 MPH and that is with an MRT bar and plate top mount.........considering fmic soon

john banks

Should buy a car with a crap bumper Anders then you wouldn't have to decide between cutting it or fitting a Pace

T-uk

perhaps mickey is really an engine builder needing the work,or owns a breakers and has a few scoobs in to break

LG John

Rolling on the floor, pi55ing myself, sh1tting myself, having strange sort of convulsions, hitting my head with my shoe, laughing my *** off so hard it hurts......at STI Wanna's......post

You can't buy comedy like that

matty01

Hi gang ,
From reading this i am more & more convinced that modding a standard car (98 uk ,in my case )is a risky bussiness at the best of times .Is there any foolproof way to more power that everyone agrees is safe ,without spending mega bucks?

john banks

Yes, a Dawes, decat, boost gauge and knocklink will keep you pretty safe. You need to spend about £170 between two gauges. Bit cheaper if you go for an AFR instead of a knocklink - under £100 then, but I would prefer the knocklink of the two. All I have on my car is a knocklink and a boost gauge, with intermittent use EGT and charge temp. Arguably oil pressure would be handy too. But then my car is running about +60% power up on standard.

[Edited by john banks - 12/29/2002 2:19:46 PM]

LG John

Foolproof.......PPP (prodrive performance pack) but it costs a fair whack and doesn't give massive gains. I'd say that getting a full decat and a tek remap is fairly safe. If you go for a custom remap you could ask the mapper to hold back on the boost a little and map for optimum safety.

john banks

He can't get a Tek for a 98 though.

matty01

does this mean that i will have to monitor the gauges to some extent because control has been taken away from the ecu or is it just to 'check' when car is under high load/speed that alls ok
p.s. thanks for info. ......invaluable.

john banks

If you mount the knocklink in a suitable position (near the a-pillar) then the big red flash it will give you if the car dets will be easily noticeable no matter what you are doing.

Boost gauge - just look at it occasionally when you are having a blast. Just like watching your speedo and RPM really. Soon get used to it and it is very easy. It is usually pretty obvious when something out of the ordinary is happening.

I think you need them anyway, not just for sustained high speed driving, and I would probably fit them to a standard car now I know what I know, although the thought of me ever leaving a turbocharged car standard now....