Phildodd06

Was having a spirited drive at the wknd and i spun a bearing!

Gutted!

I'v taken my engine out, gonna rebuild it,

What parts would i need to sort the bottom end?

Its a V9 bottom end atm (Steal rods, crank & race bearings)

Is it just a case of regrind the crank and clean everything up???

obviously replace the big end with over sized bearings???

V5 Sti Type-R

dunx

iTrader: (3)

Never re-grind is the only advice I've seen on here !

Sorry !

DunxC

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

+1!

Speak to David at APi for advice!

Ns04

scubbay

iTrader: (61)

New crank aint dear. You'll be suprised!

GC8

The OP states that he has a forged steel crank and I can assure you that they are very very dear. The 'dont regrind' advice applies (principally) to cast crankshafts, so Id disregard it until youve spoken to someone who really knows what theyre talking about. Id probably try RCM for starters...

Gear Head

iTrader: (2)

Upgraded oil pump!

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Agree on consultation with experts (e.g. APi) but not with disregarding advice, best to err on the side of caution: if you re-use a crank that should have been binned then it's a lot of time, effort and expense to put it right.

I would say disregard if people just said "go for it"

Ns04

Phildodd06

Well i dont mind paying for a new crank, but if it can b reground then i will do so.
The problem with speaking with engine builders on her, is they DO give good advise, but they are also salesmen, which means there advise could sway towards the expensive side. if that makes sense.

chrispurvis100 :- What is the reason for an uprated oil pump?

bighead

iTrader: (1)

he means do it while the engine is out save doing it later when the engine is back in

GC8

The oil pump doesnt fail, but the pressure relief valve can, so Id be looking for a modified one. With regards to an appropriate specialist: I hold API in high regard, but a forged crank isnt an everyday item and Id suggest speaking to a firm like RCM (or others, although Im not sure whom, Lateral Performance perhaps?), who deal with forged components more regularly.

Simon

Matt578

i am doing this at the moment but i am doing the head and pistons and rods too.

any ways,

Crank or Regrind upto you but personally i would go with new.

Bearings, I would do the big end and the main bearings while your at it.

Modine Oil Cooler, Pricey at around £140, try to pick up an ebay bargin! the old one can not be reused as all the metal filings front the bearing failure will be in there, they will come stright back out and reuin your new build.

Uprated oil pump. Not a lot more than a standard one, Talk to RCM

Engine Gaskets, Check out this link: Subaru Impreza Legacy Gasket Seal bottom end build kit on eBay, also, Subaru, Car Parts, Cars, Parts Vehicles (end time 30-Jun-08 20:20:54 BST)

Head Gaskets.

A place to get the blocks cleaned properly.


If your rocker cover seals, cam belt, tensioner or anything else could do with replacing now is the time to do it.

I am a bit of a noob so just take what i say as general advice as it might not be 100% right.

JohnD

iTrader: (5)

I stand to be corrected here but you risk grinding the very thin surface hardening away. Maybe ok if you then have it re-nitrided, but the cost is mounting!

JohnD

merlin24

iTrader: (1)

IMHO - Go for a new crank,even a Version 9 Nitrided crank isnt too expensive.
As JohnD said,the hardning depth isnt great on the journals and i have never seen a re-ground crank that has lasted in a Impreza.

Mick

minty

iTrader: (1)

sell me the shell if it's a type R

good luck with the build, come back bigger and better heh!

Phildodd06

Yes you all talk sense, and i can see your reasons behnd that.

I have a few points to put across, i was told by an old school engine builder i work with.

With regards to the oil pump, i mentioned replacing it, he said to strip it down, clean it check all the tolerences inside with a feeler gauge, and rebuild.

Crank, he said posibly be able 2 regring as it could only need 0.25 taking off, he said he had done no end of cossie cranks and had never had 1 snap on him yet. how ever he was not sure if you could get thicker race bearings (to match the V9 crank) to match the crank re-grind. (He has never worked on an impreza b4, but basically said all engines are the same princible at the end of the day)

He also said while its appart, to d coke the heads, and tickle the ports with some wet and dry, re seat the valves and fit new valve stem seals, cam seals, rocker cover gaskets, head gaskets.

What are your oppnions on these points???

Also are the head bolts strech bolts?

JohnD

iTrader: (5)

It's not a case of the crank snapping - it's pysically strong enough, it's the type of heat treatment process that's been applied. Low temperature surface hardening such as nitriding is very thin and is followed only by polishing of the journals. Removing 0.25mm would reveal soft material. The crank is still strong of course, but not wear resistant.

JohnD

GC8

Is this a standard cast crank, or is it a forged steel crank (not a standard part and very very expensive)?

Phildodd06

Ill find out what type of cranks are in the cossies

Phildodd06

Ok the engine builder has agreed that a regrind on the Nitrided crank is a no no, he agrees to renew (i feel better, im getting info that he agrees with)

He also agreed with upgrading to the modded oil pump.

He sujested the oil pump on there may have failed (from the reliefe valve)

Gonna think about fitting a proper oil cooler to keep the temps down, and possibly a FMIC

GC8

Ahaaa... From your original post I was under the impression that you had a forged steel crankshaft and connecting rods. If its a standard cast crank then youd be better off buying a new one. That said: tuftriding and nitriding isnt expensive, so if the only reason is the loss of journal finish.....

maps

iTrader: (3)

i got all my parts for a rebuild last week from API, the crank was a nitrated V9 and was by far the cheapest place i could find

mark

Phildodd06

Maps:- How much did you pay?

Also, i'v been told while its appart to have the crank pully, Crank, Fly wheel & Clutch cover balanced.
Also to have the rods balanced aswell.
Is this ok?

Phildodd06

Is this the standard clutch we run in the classic Type-R?

SUBARU IMPREZA TURBO UK & IMPORT EXEDY ORGANIC CLUTCH on eBay, also, Subaru, Car Parts, Cars, Parts Vehicles (end time 05-Jul-08 12:02:07 BST)

Seems like a steal to me.

Fat Boy

Ask a builder that has extensive subaru experience - not extensive cosworth experience. I'm sure he's good, but different engines have different foibles.

I'm sure he can do a good job rebuilding but,for instance and in my humble opinion, there should never have been any discussion about new or regrind. It's a new one or another rebuild bill in a while to me. A new V9 crank is amazingly cheap.

Same for oil pump - an RCM upgraded one is about £150 - which won't be much difference from labour costs on rebuilding an old one that could still have issues / swarf in it. Avoid false economy if you can.

FB (who prays he doesn't ever need to replace his billett WRC RCM crank... )

Fat Boy

balancing as per the above all makes sense too - makes for a smoother and more responsive engine

Phildodd06

Thanks Fat Boy, the good thing about this engine builder is im not going to get charged any labour, so the engine and gearbox rebuild will just cost me parts.
I can see your point about him not having experience on Subaru engines, im sure as long as i can get info from here and info from him 2 match it will be fine.

Anybody know if this clutch is the standard part we use in teh V5 Type-R?
SUBARU IMPREZA TURBO UK & IMPORT EXEDY ORGANIC CLUTCH on eBay, also, Subaru, Car Parts, Cars, Parts Vehicles (end time 05-Jul-08 12:02:07 BST)

GC8

For reliable advice, Id suggest posting in 'Technical'.

Phildodd06

Spent an hour after work starting the strip process
here's a few pics....









Clutch plate & pressure plate is just about ****ed, Fly wheel's been cooked aswell!

Ginge !

iTrader: (1)

cossie cranks are steel items, they are VERY VERY strong cranks built for rally car specs and can take over 500bhp

cossies dont suffer crank issues apart from wearing out, scoobie bearings and ALOT smaller hence have crank issues !!

wet and dry to port the heads is also a stupid idea too

Phildodd06

I was not clear when i said wet and dry the port heads.
What he said to me was do some parts, like where it goes in theres a 2mm edge between the ports, pn that part he said to make it a knife edge, to help flow, and on the bends, just smooth them abit to help them flow round the bend, NOT completly smooth all the inlets,