New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Hi all,

Thought some of you might be interested in a review of a recent modification to the car: the installation and mapping of a Simtek ECU!

First, a reminder of the stage the car was at:

UK MY99 with the following engine mods:

Haywood and Scott Sports Cat DP (wrapped)
Haywood and Scott Decat centre section
Haywood and Scott Original Scooby design backbox
Ported and wrapped OEM headers
VF35 Turbo
Walbro 255lph fuel pump
550cc injectors
Dump valve delete
Hybrid FMIC
K&N 57i Induction kit
AVCR
Ecutek Remap by Bob Rawle

At this stage, a few delta dash runs suggested that the car was producing 338bhp and 343ft lbs torque. It went well enough So, why the upgrade?

Well: a) the car is a MY99 with the notoriously fragile maf; b) I was running without a dump valve so was getting some judder resulting from maf reversion; c) the larger than necessary injectors were making light throttle applications a bit more "lumpy" than they might; d) I was always convinced that my idle wasn't as even as it should be; e) I'd heard that the Simtek ECUs would make the car nicer to drive.

So, I took off the AVC-R (no longer needed with Simtek) sold that and the std MY99 ECU with the BRD remap and got Bob to install the Simtek ECU. Now, this brings us nicely on to the first bit of advice: If you're having the Simtek fitted, try and let the mapper see the car from as cold as possible, so they can get this aspect of the mapping optimised from the outset. I got to Bob’s a few hours early and buggered off down a nearby restaurant whilst the car cooled down.

Installation was pretty straight forward: passenger foot well carpet puled back; kickplate out; old ECU out; quick modification to the ECU case to accommodate the Simtek; Simtek ECU in; switch for map selection installed in the blanking plate adjacent to the electric mirror control; connect up mapping gubbins and off we go.

Immediately you notice the mapper fiddling with settings as you drive the car cold and off boost. Simtek ECU offers live mapping don't forget, hence why you want the mapper to see the car at the broadest range of operating temps. Live mapping helps speed up the process of mapping over Ecutek as you don't have to pull over and switch the car off to upload the latest map; adjustments are made on the fly. About an hour of characteristically inept attempts at holding boost on my part follows! It never gets less embarrassing! Then we're all done. Back to Bob's for the re-installation of the kickplate and replacement of the foot well carpet, together with the removal of the mapping gubbins. Pay up and drive off.

So what's it like then? I've lived with it for about a month now in an attempt to lose the "halo" effect that tends to cloud one's judgement of the effectiveness of mods. I think now I'm in a reasonably good position to comment.

Start up. As per OEM really: sometimes first turn, other times a few turns. Not noticed anything that different in this respect to be honest. That’s probably a good thing!


Idle: significantly improved over OEM.....I'm not sure why, but my car had always been a little bit temperamental in this respect; certainly nothing drastic, but it tended to fluctuate a little bit and felt like it wanted to be set a tad higher than it was. It now idles a bit faster, but the slight "lumpiness" is gone. I did actually have to return to Bob for a hot idle tweak, as the ambient temps suddenly improved after the car was mapped and when the fans kicked in, the car was fluctuating a bit. Actually, it did this with Ecutek too; the idle was worse when the car was hot! Bob explained that the car just needed a little more fuel to stabilise things due to the effect of the higher temps on fuel atomisation....at least I think it was something like that. This sorted things out to a tee!

Off boost driving: It feels crisper than with Ecutek and the lumpiness that afflicted the car at low RPM is gone. Interestingly it feels marginally meatier as well, as if the torque curve is increasing a little more sharply. It’s definitely more responsive and I pulls more keenly from slightly lower revs in the higher gears. Gear changes are now smoother; whereas before, one might get a little judder during throttle transitions at relatively low revs, especially in the higher gears, i.e. backing off on the motorway in 5th, nothing of that nature happens now - you get the squirrel blender noise without the impression you may actually be feeding a squirrel into the car.

On boost driving: The transition between off and on boost is remarkably smooth; just taking the car though the gears, the increase in smoothness is immediately noticeable. Whereas with the Ecutek and AVCR set up the boost build up could be a little “old school”, now the power just comes in nice and progressively; it doesn’t feel like it’s just spiked, it just gives you a big, long push in the back. Speaking of which, I’ve definitely gained some torque throughout the rev range. When I asked Bob about this, he said that I was now running a little more boost with Simtek (1.4-1.5 bar) and that this was why. The spool threshold seems marginally better, especially in the higher gears: part throttle in 5th gear from about 2600rpm is really very impressive for a 2 litre turbo car – it wants to go! A welcome difference is what happens during committed gear changes i.e. when having a bit of a play through the gears: before, I’d get quite a pronounced “jerk” for want of a better term when I lifted off from 1st to 2nd, for example. But now, it’s much smoother.

Boost control/Knocklink activity: Whereas with the Ecutek and AVC-R combination, I could get some activity (ambers) when giving the car some beans, I’ve noticed that the KL is a lot quieter now. I did notice that the AVCR was letting the car boost a bit over the intended 1.35bar on occasion, maybe the lack of an integrated solution that had control over all the engine parameters was responsible? Bare in mind I also have the VF35 which is a lively soul, especially in higher gears with an FMIC. I used to get quite a bit of surge (par for the course). That also happens much less now! The boost control of this ECU seems really top rate. Of course, you also get in gear boost compensation (a must) and twin maps. My low boost is set to 1.2 bar…..no, I’m not going to use it!

MPG/Refinement: Can’t say I’ve noticed any significant difference in fuel economy. I may be imaging this, but I’m sure the car sounds smoother and more refined at cruising speeds and through the gears?!?

Extra goodies: I didn’t bother with launch control for now, as I have the OEM 5 speed and I don’t think it would like it! As for Anti lag, nah: I don’t want to create a scene with the car! It’s nice to have them as options though.

Downsides:


There are a couple of things you should be aware of:

As mentioned, to get the best out of the mapping, you really need to let the mapper see the car over as broad a range of operating temps as possible. If you can’t do this, you may have to accept that the car may require a tweak to its cold/hot start/idle. As far as I know this is just a characteristic of MAP based ECUs; it’s certainly not a reflection on the mapper!


For some reason, Simtek don’t provide a boss (or even suggest where you might be able to obtain one) to fit the charge temp sensor to your FMIC pipe work. Obviously this is not a problem for those with a TMIC. Although, in both cases, you should be aware that your mapper might not be equipped/prepared to fit this for you. It’s not an issue for the mapping, but will need to be taken care of soon after. I’m not sure what fitment involves for a TMIC, so I’ll limit comment to FMIC fitment. Many people seem to advocate screwing the thing in the FMIC pipe work, which by all accounts is perfectly ok. I would say, however, that FMIC pipes aren’t that thick and won’t give the screw much “bite”. The best way of doing it would be to get a boss custom fabricated, but non-one I spoke to seemed to know where to get this done. H&S weren’t interested, for example. This does come as a bit of a shock if you’re not expecting it. Given that this is otherwise such a quality product, it does seem like a bit of an oversight on behalf of the manufactures to not make provisions that mean that one doesn’t have to resort to a “fudge job” to get a sensor used by the ECU installed properly. Even just a list of people who sell or will fabricate such a boss would be much appreciated! Grumble over!

Oh and, of course, you lose the std Subaru diagnostic plug in feature, which might be a bummer if you wanted a quick way of spotting a duff sensor etc.

Finally, there is no equivalent of delta dash with Simtek as of yet, so no road derived bhp and torque estimates to report I fear. The bum dyno says slightly more of each though!

Conclusion: Excellent upgrade for a classic (very cost effective if you have an Ecutek’d ECU and AVCR to flog): across the board noticeable improvements in drivability, much greater scope for future tuning, no more pesky maf to worry about, easier and quicker mapping and a few fancy options e.g. Launch control if you are so inclined! I recommend it!

Thanks: To the “Guru”, as I believe he has become known, Bob Rawle, for his A1 mapping, advice and for being a real gentleman to deal with!

Hope that’s of some interest/help to some of you!

Ns04

Semper

Great write up. Still wouldn't take a Simtek over standard ECU at below say 450bhp ish. But hey.

Glad you're happy!

beef-on-the-bone

iTrader: (5)

bloody comprehensive write up!!!

am looking forward to getting mine, only hear good things and reading things like this only help!!

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

I should add the proviso that my experiences relate to a classic, which IMHO benefits from an ECU upgrade much ealier than a new age which has the more capable Denso ECU that can handle things like in gear boost compensation etc...

Semper

Still, no knock correction...it's a biggy for me, but see where's you're coming from! A flashing light just doesn't cut the mustard, would MUCH prefer to retard timing and have my map maxed out rather than with a safety margin.

MartynJ

Nice write up NS as per normal, although the fitment of the charge temp sensor wouldn't have been an issue should you have chosen a proper garage to do the job for you.
We make in house all of our own ally or stainless boss's for the sensor and this means no issues come fitment time.

MartynJ

It's coming, as is a boost cut, fuel enrichment and a solid check light take me to your dealer safe mode for when it suspects serious det. I should also add that closed loop knock control isn't the be all and end all, and that cars can destroy themselves none the less.

Semper

Free upgrade? It's a good updated feature list!

Fair play re: comment about standard KC, but better than none! Having become a serious datalogger, I just know how important it can be in protecting the car. A numpty not watching lights on KS-3 or CEL will still blow their car up, but the ECU can always react faster than that and do what it can.

Not that it matters for me, still no DBW. But folk should be made aware that it's not 100% there yet.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

I think the issue has been: under what conditions does one re-instate the timing once retarded? In the event of any knock, I'd probably want to get it straight down to the mapper to have a look even in the event of ignition retard as I wouldn't like the idea of the car running below par!

Most likely a duff sensor or batch of fuel in most cases I'd imagine.

Ns04

Semper

It pushes timing back in under certain "clear" conditions, a bit at a time. Scoobypedia | Trusted knowledge for everything Subaru | Knowledge / Subaru's Knock Control Strategy Explained

shaggy6

iTrader: (2)

Very informative!! ... ive only noticed one issue with mine which i get ocasionally which is the "simtek bump" since ive had the map update i have only felt it once so im hoping it wont come back.. as regards to the map sensor this is how i mounted mine for my FMIC

mattpat

iTrader: (1)

Excellent write up

really informative as I'm off to Andy F on Thursday to fit and map Simtek

You set up is simlar to mine except I'm running an AFP TD04 hybrid
I'm also runing without a DV.

Its a shame about the loss of delta dash and diagnostic tools but the trade off seems well worth it

I'm planning on further uprgrades later this year so it also seems sensible to remove the ever susceptable my99 maf

as you say its cost effective what is my ecutek ecu mapped by Andy worth?

cheers
Matt

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

I worked it out this way, mate:

Ecutek remap without licence circa £650

If you charge 250 for the ECU, someone will then only have to pay the mapper about £200 for a custom map for their car, thus saving £200 on a first Ecutek remap.

That should get you a few offers! You could probably get a bit more if you're not as generous as I

Let me know what you make of Simtek - I think you'll be very impressed

mattpat

iTrader: (1)

thanks mate will do

thats some of the cost recouped...or to spend on something new


cheers
matt

dynamix

iTrader: (3)

True enough but I am guessing that most people would try it a few times to make sure it is det before trying to book a date with their mapper. (if they spot the light the first time or dont mistake it for the gear change flash). Sometimes these dates can be a few weeks into the future and/or the other end of the country... that might be enough to push the engine over the edge and cause real damage.

I suggested a strategy for this a good few months back to Steve Simpson but I guess this hasnt been done yet.

Great write up though NS_04 - very informative.

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Ta mate

I think active knock control would be a good feature....it'd have to work better than the Classic OEM's strategy, though, which -apparently- has occasionally just stood by a let engines det themselves to oblivion!

mit

iTrader: (10)

Have you got the new power figures?

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

Hey Tim.

No mate; you can't do a deltadash run with Simtek; the software has yet to be produced, and I don't do rolling roads for performance calculation purposes: I was always much more interested in the performance figures e.g. how quickly the car could cover certain increments in speed. It definitely feels more torquey, which is explained by the boost increase that Bob applied during mapping I guess. It had a very healthy figure of 343 ft lbs before.... So your guess is as good as mine!

How's that lovely car of yours mate?

mit

iTrader: (10)

I know what you mean.I remember David and yourself discussing the Simtec, glad it's sorted the little niggles you had. Are you starting to worry about the box at all? You must be around the 350/350 mark now, if not more!
The cars great thanks, done a few cosmetic mods since we met, facelift and a few carbon goodies. I had a good cleaning session yesterday, hoping to get some good pics of it up tonight.
I'm hoping to get to Santa Pod this summer, be good to see how the car does.

DJ_Jon

iTrader: (7)

Great write up NS_04 - I agree with a lot of your points, mine definitly felt smoother with the Simtek compared to the Apexi/Std ECU. definitly a great upgrade for the MY99 cars & I would recomend it to any fellow owners.

darms

iTrader: (5)

Very informative write up as usual mate