vmax

Just replaced my original discs and padd on the front of my MY01 21K miles. Discs had some more life in them but i saw it as an opporunity to enhance the braking performance. I had EBC grooved discs and RED pad's fitted under good advice. I would normaly would have planned this type a purchase a bit more in advance but experiancing brake fade is not a nice experiance so I got them changed sharpish.

Now I'm reading how crap they are and how they warp discs and fade easily. So I'm not a happy bunny at the moment. Also a couple of posts mentioned warranty. I didn't even stop to think that that would affect warranty. Is this true.... ?

What next...Have I affected my warranty because I'm running toyo's instead of Bridgestone potenza's.

I was advised that this is a good setup and i MUST bed them in gently and the performance will turn from crap to good.

Have I made a bad purchase and kissed my warranty goodbye.

DaveD

iTrader: (2)

vmax,

all things are relative. I ran EBC green pads & discs for 18 months (2-pot brakes) with no worries. Only got fade on the odd occasion (braking from 3-figure speeds), and the pads soon came back to life. The green pads ran very hot, and would have warped the std discs, but didn't warp the EBC discs.
I've recently changed to some 2nd hand OEM 4-pots, discs and pads, but have had these warp already (came back straight), so the EBC set-up must still be some kind of improvement!

Not sure about your warranty......

Claudius

Found this info on EBC red pads:

"EBC's semi-metallic Redstuff formulation is a true asphalt race pad with medium lifetime and a friction level of about 0.3µ steadily rising to 0.33µ at 750ºC. Redstuff is very kind to brake discs and can be used on highway vehicles for extreme duty use as well as on race cars.

Redstuff gives longer pad life under extreme road conditions

Features and Benefits of Redstuff:
friction co-efficient starting at 0.3µ and rising to 0.33µ once warm
medium initial bite with friction steadily increasing with heat
heat stable to an incredible 750ºC
low disc abrasion"


"medium intial bite" means they dont slow you down when cold, ie. watch it in the morning.

"extremely kind to the disc" means that they dont brake well. You cannot have the low friction, low abrasion and good stopping power: that would be a contradiction.

Friction coefficient: unless I misread that, 0.3 friction coefficient is pretty ridiculous and hardly a tarmac spec brake pad! WTF?!? For reference, my Pagid RS14 brake pads have a friction coefficient of 0.64. These are tarmac spec pads that are used on GrN Evos (that win the rally).

Not sure about the discs. Are they two piece or monopiece, ie. is the bell separate and screwed to the disc or not? If not, you may warp them under heavy use (with different pads )

[Edited by Claudius - 8/24/2002 3:14:25 PM]

ScoobyJawa

Having used reds on my MY99 4 pots they were utter carp IMHO.

Faded when hot, didn't work from cold and wore out in about 3k miles tops on EBC Turbogroove discs, you sure get what you pay for and EBC being cheap sums them up - u/s.

tntsystems

i dont quite know why, but i found the EBC reds very good, and they didnt fade under extreme braking from high speeds. They do take a bit of warming up (hence maybe you guys saying they are cack) i found standing on them twice hard, the third attempt wanted to throw me thorough the windscreen . Personally i would rather know i had to stomp on them twice and know they would stop me after than waiting for them to fade in a life / death situation. (p.s. the mintex 1155 pads i have just paid £130 quid for are ****e in comparison) I ran both sets in for 250 miles before hard braking..

vmax

Thanks for the feedback guys!

So it looks as though if I change my pads to something with a higher friction rating I could Warp my EBC discs. If i stick with the pads I have got now I have to remember to try and avoid driving into my neighbours living room when pulling out of my drive in the morning.

Then as soon as when I'm on the road, warm them up as soon as possible to get any decent performance when I REALLY need it.

What should I have bought guys ?

ScoobyJawa

I've moved on to Ferodo DS2500 and they are leaps and bounds better than the reds, IMHO

Charlie H

Strange, I`ve used red stuff pads for over a year on standard discs and have never had a problem with them. The initial bite is a bit weak until you get a bit of heat but I`ve had to do a couple of sharp halts and they have never let me down, even lasted a track day at croft last July and still going strong. Could the problem lie with the EBC disc???

jim litten

After trying another make of disc using ds2500 pads that warped after 3 laps on track having done 3000miles on road, I got EBC discs ( only ones I could get my hands on asap ) and run mintex 1144 pads I've had no problem other than the pads are very dirty.


Jim

Chod

I put EBC Discs and greenstuff pads on the front of my 2 pots about 600 miles ago. Did a track day last weekend and found them to be quite good. Didn't get any fade and they didn't warp the discs. Noisier than standard due to the cross and dimples, but def stop better.

Terry

ScoobyJawa

I've warped 3 pairs of their Turbogroove discs - first 2 with their own greenstuff pads (EBC reckon you can't warp their discs with their pads so its full replacement if you do), and lastly with ferodo DS2500, but I knew these would anyway, just want to kill the discs now and get something decent.....

MY99 4 pots BTW.

hoonunit

How come i never saw any threads like this BEFORE i bought my redstuff pads? Just finished running them in now but haven't yet noticed any real improvement over the standard OE pads. There may be a little extra fade resistance but its hard to tell since the basic bite isn't very strong anyway.

What's worse is i spent £95 on a set but have since seen them for £78. Aaarrrrgghh!!

Claudius

Not necessarily, but it's probable.

Let's not exaggerate, but watch it. I had ****ty Tarox pads like that once and had to keep the left foot on the brake when taking off in the morning to avoid crashing into stuff when braking from cold, which also happend to me once (new wheel and tyre and front bumper required). Just a word of caution so you dont do it all over again...

Two piece discs with a separate bell and Pagid RS14 pads, high wet boiling point DOT 5.1 brake fluid and steel braided brake hoses as a cheap option.
For ideal braking, front and rear Movit brake kit with RS14 pads and bigger master cylinder (you could get the master cylinder right now btw).

Hoppy

Claudius, why Movit front AND rear? Have you fitted them to a Scoob? If so, you're the first in the world.

Why not just APR fronts (or another similar top-brand upgrade) that fits under most alloy wheels unlike Movit, makes do with standard rears (we've had this debate before - why don't you listen to the answers?) and doesn't require a new master cyclinder?

At least we agree that EBC are not the best brakes to be had

Best regards,

Richard.

Claudius

I was talking to vmax.

[Edited by Claudius - 8/29/2002 2:07:02 AM]

Hoppy

Silly me. I thought this was a public forum. Apologies for the intrusion

Richard.

vmax

Easy guys... All opinions are valuable. My pads are just starting to bed in now and are improving. So far so good.

You are all right about being naff cold.

care3

i thought the movits required spacers

Claudius

That depends on wheel size, offset and spoke design. It would be a good idea to buy lightweight 17 inch wheels for your car anyway.

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

Hey Claudius, you really are into the arrogance at the mo. aren't you?

dowser

I would call my Movit's "extremely kind to the disc" (original organic pads, 25k km's, 4 track days and disks like new) - does that mean "they dont brake well"? Oh, and the pads aren't even 50% worn yet. Perhaps I should try using them?

There will be a rear kit for Impreza in the not to distant......hopefully, lol!

I'm currently hunting down a lightweight 17" wheel with an ET45 offset, my current wheels are a bit heavy - any ideas?

Richard

ScoobyJawa

OZ Superleggara's? They are VERY light wheels and I know two people with them in ET45.........

dowser

Thanks - are these the same design as P1 wheels? Need to check out some photos...

Richard

ScoobyJawa

Similar but slightly different, less spokes....

Hope this works:

Claudius

Naa, just didnt like Hoppy's reply.

Claudius

LOL. I meant standard brake setup. You know that

On the Movit site, it says they make rear brake kits. From what you say, though, it sounds like they dont?

dowser

Thanks ScoobyJawa - look good!

Claudius - no, not yet...at least, not for the Scoob. Do you know ScoobyMike off the MLR (E6tm), he has a fantabulous Movit set-up front and rear

Richard

[Edited by dowser - 9/2/2002 6:36:52 PM]

[Edited by dowser - 9/2/2002 6:38:35 PM]

Hoppy

Claudius, do you have a problem with being wrong? It happens to everyone once in a while.

Your recent suggestion to fit Movits front and rear on a Scoob is one of the most stupid responses I've read in a long time. And irresponsible (considering the importance of brake balance).

Best regards, mate. I'm sure you mean to be helpful, but you don't always come over that way

Cheers,

Richard.

Claudius

Yeah I do , and yeah he does

Hope you'll get those soon

Claudius

Hoppy/Richard,

why dont you get yourself some Godspeed brakes then? The brakes for the Gods of Speed! Like yourself For GBP 95, they will even fit them for you and put in brake fluid!

And yeah, you're right, Porsche brakes (Movit) suck, dont fit them.

Sorry for talking so much BS everybody, I'll stick to the muppet forum from now on, since that's what I am with my BS talk.