On my MY02 WRX, so far i have upgraded my pads to DS-2500's, made some difference. Using dot6 fluid and have fitted a cylinder bracket.

I still lack that sharpe bit you get on most other modern cars ( itook one of the company Vectras out the other day and nearly hit the windscreen) Is it time to invest in new disks or braided hoses?

A profession opinion would be greatly aprechiated.

 

I have big brake kit (Godspeed), braided hoses, no cylinder bracket and absolutely no bite.

Had the same experience as you the other day. Was driving a Toyota Avensis loaner and when I hit the brakes the seatbelt locked before I nearly hit the windscreen. I have never had that first initial brake bite with the Subaru as other cars give.?? Itīs like the servo isnīt powerfull enough.

 

most cars are "over servo'd" in relation to the Scooby, hence the lack of 'bite' from the pedal..............

 

My wee mum has a Kia Picanto and as soon as you touch the brakes they bite hard. I'd like a bit more bite from my Scooby brakes, but I wouldn't want it as much. I find a more progressive pedal gives better feel than something that's just like an on/off switch

 

True, but a little more bite would give me more confidence........ i think my problem lies with me driving a Fiesta during the week and only taking the scoob at at weekends. So that means i need a new right foot!

 

I frequently see people on here complaining about the the 4pot Subaru brakes being rubbish etc... and I personally couldn't see what on earth they were talking about.

Then I took a Focus hire car out for a day. The slightest touch the the brakes caused the seatbelt to engage!! It was horrible, but I could immediately see where the complaints about the Scoobies brakes were coming from; it takes a lot more effort to produce similar retardation in the Scooby. The inference from this is that the brakes on the scooby aren't as powerful/effective. However, this is not the case, it's just that the brakes in many cars these days have way too much servo assistance. It's not what the keen driver wants; you want to be able to modulate braking, for braking effort to be proportional to input effort. Give the brakes on a scooby a proper shove and they'll stop you VERY convincingly!! If they don't something is up!

Ns04 MY99 (std 4pots and pagid black pads)

 

But I am a keen driver (former danish roadracing champ) and I still think that the Scooby brakes need a bit more initial bite to be perfect. I know it will stop perfectly if you just violate that pedal like mad. That is good for the track ( yes I took it there several times) but not perfect for the road. So a little more brake servo assistance would be nice.

 

try changing to braided hoses, and try a differnet compound pad, the ds2500 is a fast road pad, something similar with good fade resistance is the pagid RS421, slightly better pad IMHO

 

Glad i'm not the only one who thinks my scooby's brakes are crap..
I bought a my99 with the subaru imprinted 4 pot calipers and to say i wasn't impressed was an understatement.
I've now bought tar-ox grooved discs and pads and it has made a very slight difference but as others say still doesnt bite, i've got some goodridge hoses to go on and also some dot5 fluid, so after fitting the new lines and putting the new fluid in i'm hoping to actually stop rather than just slow down.

 

Ive spent most of the weekend zooming about and im happier now i spent some time in the car. Its just such a difference from other cars.

 

I have found the DS2500 lacks initial bite where Yellowstuffs type R and the 4-2.1 Pagids are much better pads!
Racing pads have much better initial bite due to different density.

 

I have now got the brake cyclinder bracket on mine 01 wrx with Godspeed 335mm with cheap pads and they bite alot better with the bracket than before. ok the disc are coming to the end of life but are working better than they did when new!

RR

 

Can't say I noticed any real difference with braided hoses to be honest.

Might ask a m8 to make up a brake bracket for me as he's handy with a welder

 

whats so special about this bracket then that could possibly make your brakes any better?
and if its that good where are they sold and how much?

 

Ask a m8 to sit in the car and squeeze the pedal hard. If you open the bonnet while he's doing it you'll notice some flex in the bulkhead. Some have said that stopping the flex, gives back some "feel" to the pedal. Haven't experienced it personally so can't really comment.

MRT do a bracket for around Ģ60. You could make one yourself out of solid metal for much cheapness.

 

Cool cheers Ozzy, that makes some sense.
whos mrt though?

 

Australian tuning comapny! .... http://www.mrtrally.com.au/

r.e. the performance of the brakes .... my Mothers MY03 Fiesta feels as if its got more initial bit than the AP 6 pots on my MY99 car .... but you try slamming your foot on the Fiestas brakes .... instant ABS and no control. The whole point of good brakes is that they are progressive giving you a lot of control, but when you do plant your foot, they stop you VERY quickly and VERY safely!!

 

I got mine off Fleabay like the others say, its stops the flexing of the bulkhead, everything and anything to improve the scooby brakes!!

RR

 

Ebay sell them ,but be warned they are shipped from Japan and take ages to arrive and the instructions are printed on bog roll and in Japanese. But i found a slight improvment in brake feel.

 

I thought my brakes were poor and just swapped pads to mintex 1144 from redstuffs (as I only got the redstuffs up to proper operating temperature about once a month) and they bite like Mike tyson. they probably won't do so well on the track but I'll just put the redstuffs back on when the occasion arises.

 

I'm sure I've read somewhere that the scoob brake pedal operation is designed to be progressive by opening ports in the servo in sequence. You will not get the full servo assistance until you press pedal further down. This lack of initial bite is not necessarily indicative of poor brakes. My wifes Golf almost puts me through the screen and I have to make a special effort to touch pedal gently. I prefer the scoob concept.

Incidentally does anyone have an idea of what level of brake improvement starts to come up against the limit of tyre grip and or ABS limit. I have never seen hard data on braking forces achieved by any of the after market systems. Does any exist or are we doomed to subjective comment?

 

This could be worth a read http://www.zeckhausen.com/Testing_Brakes.htm

 

Ok, I agree that the bite isnt the best, but the pedal feel is better than most modern cars I have driven.

I have the m1144 pads all round. 4 pots with 335mm grooved godspeeds up front and 2 pots with 290mm grooved godspeeds on the rear of my MY98 WRX.

Brakes are ace.

 

yes very interesting! but not very encouraging for the bigger brakes enthusiasts. For the 350Z tested, 100 to zero stopping dist. improvements of about 2% ie. 334ft for standard brakes of 296*24 front and 292*16 rear to 327ft for upgrade to 355*32 with same rears. This would be almost impossible to notice unless measured, and hardly worth the trouble and expense. The only real advantage seemed to be the lower temps on repeated stopping from 100 to zero . So we are really talking severe track use.

Perhaps this is why Subaru didnt fit big brakes is the first place and maybe are doing so now to cater for fashion and looks. Just a bit of bling!!

I wonder how much of the subjective impressions of better braking that we read about all the time are due to simply replacing a knackered system with new discs and better pads etc.

ps I cant recall exactly what the did with the calipers. I think they were also improved.

Even the stop tech 4 wheel 355mm system wasnt much better.

 

I was thinking of going down this route for my P1 with 2 pot rears from bug eyed WRX complete with discs and hubs . Did you re-line the 4 pots before fitting the Godspeeds?

 

I'd like to see the same tests with 355 mm AP 6 pots.

Is this on Shaun's lists of mods to review and write up on Scoobynet?

Regards,

Ian

 

What do you mean by re-line? If you mean new seals then yes.

 

The wifes evo 4 on standard brakes with pagid blue pads feels better than my scoob with ap 4 pots , braided lines, vented rears, :-(
mine is due for a fluid and pad change so that may improve it
Have a good one
Tim
ps , if changing from 1 type of pad to another,eg fero 2500 > pagid , always give your disc`s a good clean with sandpaper, they leave a coating on the disc that sometimes is in-comatable with another pad material,

 

Recently I have transformed the braking efficiency on my scoob. Simply by cleaning the front brakes which had binding pads and were full of dirt and corrosion from the winter, in Denmark we use a lot of salt to clear the roads in winter (200 kg a car I read somewhere). I also changed the rear pads to new ones and the brakes are now working fine and thatīs even with a sticking piston in the front. Anyone have a good guide how to loosen the sticking piston? can I do it without dismantling the caliper, like with a grip or something and taking care not to hurt the piston?

 

Sometimes the pot can be unstuck with a little force, protecting it with some wood. Dismantling the caliper would give you a better swing of the hammer

My calipers had 2 pistons stuck and one needed heating to free it. I would bite the bullet and have them stripped with both the seals and pistons replaced. The costs are pretty low, it's just the labour that may push the cost of a refurb up a little. Well worth it though.